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#14140 - 12/30/12 12:26 PM Re: new developments around my son - help? [Re: marinde]
Dianne E. Offline

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Registered: 11/15/02
Posts: 2788
Loc: United States
Hi marinde, have been away for the last week and am just getting back.

Thank you so very much, yes we very rarely hear any success stories and really appreciate hearing yours.

Was there anything in particular that helped you turn the corner? As much as you can share would be very much appreciated.

Di

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#14866 - 04/19/13 04:06 PM Re: new developments around my son - help? [Re: Dianne E.]
marinde Offline
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Registered: 09/19/11
Posts: 58
Hi Dianne,

Sorry for not replying sooner.

My story has taken yet another turn. He has definitely lost the acknowledgement case. For the visitation case a forensic psychologist has spoken very long with me and him. Until now she concluded I was healthy, except for a normal fear response. She thinks I can't have ptsd because you have to be in a war or accident or so for that(?). On him she concluded: he expressed many emotions but they felt shallow, he seemed totally devoid of social feelings, not capable of empathy, changing colours like a chameleon, telling her just what she wanted to hear, extremely focussed on power and control, selfcentred, not capable of reflection, fragmented, empty (- wow!). She had him stuck and he finally admitted he physically hurt me when I was pregnant, but he "didn't understand", "thought it was a game" and "I liked it" (wtf?!?!? what's not clear about "stop, it hurts me and the baby"). She thinks he is not capable of love, not understanding the needs and feelings of our son on the most basic level, can become threatening and physically dangerous especially when he feels threatened or out of control. She thinks he might possibly be capable of extreme and bizar violence when cornered.

She'll advice for psychological treatment, educating him on raising a child, building up visitation (why on earth? after such an observation?!?), but limited and supervised (hurray!). The fact that I am so terrified of him that I can't take care of my son is solely my responsibility and of no relevance to her advice, she said (in a nicer way).

Her temporary diagnosis: AUTISM.

She thinks there's a lot of overlap with psychopathy in him, but he has a good job so he can't be a true psychopath(?) and she finds him too emotionally inadequate and too controlled. She said she did not observe his sadist, paranoid and truely manipulative side, but this doesn't mean it's not there, and she was still doubting whether he was evil or ignorant. He did the goofy-little-boy-act on her ("Oops! Did that hurt her? Oh really? I totally missed that..") and I believe she still underestimates him. But well...it's already WAY more than I expected... and it at least says I'm not crazy for fearing him.

Still not sure what to think of this??? And what can I expect of psychotherapy? He always used my explanations to become more manipulative and more hurtful. Should I block visitation? Or work along? I have no idea what to do next...

Anyway. Not sure whether I'm on the right forum now ;-). But still some things that helped me:

- Collecting all the tiny evidences and testimonies that I could find. Even things not directly threatening. Like a midwife testifying he had a distant and onsafe attitude during the birth of our son, my boss testifying that he saw me change during the relationship, an e-mail where he talks about guns (i live in europe), or some weird e-mails about domestic violence his sister sent me.
- Just repeating over and over and over again that it's not safe, I won't comply and he has to be tested by a forensic psychologist first. Not giving in to his pressure, or that of so called child protectors. Once you've given something away (visitation, acknowledgement) it's harder to turn back.
- Seeking help everywhere until I found the right persons. Having professionals testify that I was healthy before and psychologically hurt by him, and solely by him, so much that it heavily disturbed the home environment of my son (i had to go to a clinic to recover). This was a rather risky move...since they could say: your son is not okay with you. A couragous (dumb, lawbreaking?) psychiatrist even testified that he thought of psychopathy based on my story.
- Having day care and a child therapist test my son and confirm that he is doing well in my care.
- Not giving him information at all. Clearing my computer, changing my e-mail and telephone number, instructing loved ones not to answer to his inquiries, leaving him in the dark about my preparations for the court. In retrospect I should have recorded telephone conversations.
- Showing people that I was open and capable of self reflection.
- Surrounding myself with only sweet and loving people that I trusted.

And further: luck... lots and lots of luck. Which I also wish to you..

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#14867 - 04/19/13 05:12 PM Re: new developments around my son - help? [Re: marinde]
marinde Offline
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Registered: 09/19/11
Posts: 58
Oh something else...she answered to the references to sexual abuse and domestic violence (poems, movies, books, remarks, threats), the manipulations, the stealth sadism towards me and my son, the sexual assaults, the stalking by saying "maybe he just didn't understand, he doesn't have the capability to recognize it, and the psychologist can explain to him precisely how to understand all the feelings of others, all the feelings of your son". This gives me the creeps. He's smart enough and I can still remember his grins when doing to my newborn son exactly those things he found out I feared most. What if they give him an intensive course over the years in recognizing my sons feelings?? Now, apparantly, a forensic psychologist can still find out something is quite wrong. I don't really care which label they give him. But I've seen his sadism. How can I prevent that they turn him from a still somewhat clumsy sadist that slips now and then, into a more stealth and refined sadist?

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#14894 - 04/23/13 03:40 PM Re: new developments around my son - help? [Re: marinde]
marinde Offline
member

Registered: 09/19/11
Posts: 58
Ohhh...sigh... frown

Research continues, she talked to him again and now is drawing back...maybe he didn't mean it all that bad, some people with autism can be good fathers, he seems to really understand and wants to change now (yeah right, how many times did i hear that?), he really didn't mean to hurt you with that (then what exactly DID he mean to do by dragging me through the house by my hairs when highly pregnant and telling me he would get whatever he wanted?!?), we had a real good conversation now and he cares about not hurting you and your son, he was much different from the first time (yeah, he's different all the time, that's the problem)...permanent supervision might not be necessary afterall, if he does well for one year he'll be okay...he just needs to learn, he needs to have a chance. He really wants to be involved.

Aren't autistic people supposed to be real bad at manipulating? :-S

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#14897 - 04/23/13 05:34 PM Re: new developments around my son - help? [Re: marinde]
1962 Offline
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Registered: 01/31/13
Posts: 206
Marinde,

Dianne is temporarily off line, but the rest of us are here!

It sounds like your "Psychopath" is intelligent and has learned to play the system. It is so easy for the therapists to be manipulated by the "Psychopath"s as they tend to be like us victims and look for the best in people and give excuses for behaviors that are unacceptable.

Maybe a counselor who deals with psychopathy as part of their regular career would be a better match. I found one accidently by calling a few groups in my health care registry. Upon intake I asked for someone who dealt with persoanlity disorders - specifically cluster Bs.

Although I felt that the counselor himself was a "Psychopath", who better to know one??? It was very validating for me.

Best to you Marinde.

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#14907 - 04/24/13 07:27 AM Re: new developments around my son - help? [Re: 1962]
marinde Offline
member

Registered: 09/19/11
Posts: 58
Thanks for your response!

This actually was a forensic psychologist, with experience in psychopathy! Problem with my ex is that he is not the typical psychopath. He DOES have some features of autism... like intense interests (f.e. engineering), being autistically systematic and obsessive(also in his revenge), some sort of awkwardness in social contacts, fragmented understanding of the world, making weird communicational missers. So people see this first and think "hey...that's not a psychopath, that's an autist!", discard all the rest as "misunderstanding" and are way more easy for him to be controlled. And then come in the psychopath features. He gets more tuned in with them, picks up their signals better, understands what they want to hear and winds them around his finger. You know what the stupid thing is... even I was again doubting myself when she told me he's an autist and he really didn't understand. Even though I KNOW what actually happened and it certainly was not "accidental". I have no idea what to think of him now. Only that he should NEVER be near my child.

Maybe a psychopath as a therapist would indeed be the best, they must have a much larger understanding of this type of behaviour ;-)

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#14913 - 04/24/13 06:34 PM Re: new developments around my son - help? [Re: marinde]
1962 Offline
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Registered: 01/31/13
Posts: 206
I think that as someone who has loved a "Psychopath" for a long time, I understand your doubts and also your concerns. How is it that we can love someone, bear their children and then try to understand that this was all a scam.

If I had young children, I know I would be as concerned as you are.

I actually felt that I had a better understanding of my husband and a greater appreciation of a true lack of conscience. The counselor acknowledged that the "Psychopath" has feelings but has absoultely no conscience. Scary to be sure for all of us if this is true of all of them.

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#15180 - 05/20/13 09:06 AM Re: new developments around my son - help? [Re: 1962]
marinde Offline
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Registered: 09/19/11
Posts: 58
Thanks...

I got rid of my doubts again.

Am shocked how easily even forensic psychologists are manipulated. First she saw quite a lot, but blamed it on autism.

Then she had another chat with him. Now he's the victim and I'm the perpetrator.

She now thinks he's the victim in many of his relationships, is not capable of physical violence and that did not happen in the relationship(which is quite remarkable, because he admitted to dragging me around the house by my hairs...), is stable and intelligent, and he just accidently did some unhandy things because of his autism. Even threatening with childabduction is turned in such a way that he's the victim and I'm the perpetrator (he was fighting for his rights to see his child and out of love for his child he accidently treatened with abduction).

I have many reports, from my boss to other psychologists to the clinic that observed me daily for 2 months because of severe ptsd. They all report that I am a cooperative, kind, easygoing person and I have no personality disorder, only I am in total panic whenever something happens around my ex. Her conclusion: mother is a controlling person and might have an underlying personality disorder. He controlled even the tiniest details of my life...to the brand of diapers that I had to buy for my son (from my money, in my house) or whether we could eat/sleep/use medicine. And now I'm controlling?!?

It's such a trap. When I don't respond, all the lies will stay intact. When I'm trying to protect my child and set straight all the lies.... I am a controlling [censored]. And they use it to rationalize his behaviour ("no wonder he got so threatening...").

I also notice that they are just writing towards a certain conclusion... there MUST be visitation.

I'm just desperate now. Does anyone have any comforting words or tips how to continue?

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#15181 - 05/20/13 09:09 AM Re: new developments around my son - help? [Re: marinde]
marinde Offline
member

Registered: 09/19/11
Posts: 58
Oh... and: she tells me I cannot have ptsd, because what happened was not bad enough for that. You have to be in "something really bad like a car crash" for that - I'd rather have 20 car crashes instead of having this creep in my sons life.

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