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#14741 - 04/08/13 02:11 PM Re: Red Flags [Re: Shayna]
1962 Offline
member

Registered: 01/31/13
Posts: 206
Shayna,

I know that antidepressants work for some people. I have been prescribed something, and found I slept the night and most of the next day was so groggy. If I ever need to sleep I can try a 1/2 dose, but seriously I don't like to feel foggy like that- reminds me too much of being with the "Psychopath".

I think right now, my mind is only letting me feel some things. As a friend said to me, if I thought about everything that I went through all at once, my head would explode frown
gross visual there.

I have been reading your posts and you sound strong!!! Nice to see. smile


Edited by 1962 (04/08/13 02:12 PM)

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#14748 - 04/09/13 06:15 AM Re: Red Flags [Re: 1962]
Shayna Offline
member

Registered: 03/05/13
Posts: 120
Ah, I don't like the groggy fog the next day with some sleep/anxiety meds either. I don't blame you for not wanting to take them. I don't even like some allergy meds because they change the way I feel.

I read something a while back about people that go through something so awful that their brains really do filter a lot of the details out. One example was someone experiencing something horrific that when they flash back to that experience, everything is either in black and white or there's just one colour present. To me what you're saying makes complete sense, and I'm so sorry you're going through something like this.

Strong? Maybe. I had an off night last night but I definitely didn't contact him. I realize my X is fairly harmless compared to the other stories I've been reading so in that way I feel very fortunate. I just want him gone at this point. I still have a lot of physical symptoms, the anxiety, the tight shoulders, the hives, but it's getting better. Last night sucked but today's a new day!

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#14934 - 04/26/13 01:16 PM Re: Red Flags [Re: Anonymous]
crocodile Offline
member

Registered: 04/25/13
Posts: 329
My personal list of red flags:
- heinous things about you/other people or outward threats (he once said plainly he can destroy me at will) said in a disguise of a joke or in some confusing context - normal people usually don't say things like that even if they sometimes have evil thoughts because they are aware of the wrongness of them
- total calm and lack of strong reactions to even most terrible situations other than irritability/anger
- little fear and/or disgust
- denying the lies even if caught red handed - normal people also will deny a lie when afraid of consequences but usually not when there is hard evidence: then they usually apologise, are ashamed and so on - psychopath will immediately, without blinking either subtly change the story to fit the facts or deny ever lying to you (typical gaslighting strategy)
- no sensitivity to emotional value of art, even if he claims that he adores certain works/artists - the way he describes art (my personal Psychopath always liked art that he considered logical and even if I was seeing emotional value in it he simply couldn't grasp my perspective and was totally immune to metaphors)
- changing opinions about things and people and constant inconsistencies in told stories, especially if other people deny them (a psychopath tells you lies that suit him at the moment and later forgets what he said - if he constantly breaks promises and then tells you he's never said anything like that or you clearly misunderstood him like a 10th time in a week - that's a red flag)
- apparent fast changes of mood: one moment his poor/sick/tired and just wants to go home and a moment later he decides to go to the party (especially if he was sick when he needed to do something for you), he can also talk differently to different people: he is angry at you but smiling and polite to everyone else and shows no signs of distress (normal people often try to avoid putting others into uncomfortable situations when quarreling with a spouse but if somebody can completely turn a switch on his mood that suggests he may not be concerned that much in the first place)
- rare weird responses to your emotional states (sometimes he would completely misinterpret what I said about my feelings and when I reacted surprised he pretended he didn't hear well what I was saying) - I guess that is because a psychopath can only interpret and appropriately respond to emotional situations he has already had a chance to explore in the past - he has no empathy and feelings himself so he has no inner knowledge (he is probably going to learn fast and respond properly next time though)
- if he's clever (from what I learned many psychopaths are not concerned but my personal Psychopath was super careful not to get detected and was stressed when things were getting out of control) he will avoid leaving any evidence of his misconduct like he will only tell you things in private, not write e-mails or messages or discuss things in front of others, especially if they are people loyal to you
- if he has delayed or weird responses to emotional reactions or stressful events of others (e.g. when I was feeling bad and I cut myself his primary concern was not what was going on with me but rather his irritation that I stained his sweater with blood and now he has to wash it, smiling when he sees somebody crying, etc.)
- stories about other women (either on how attractive he is, or how other women all are sluts and want to cheat on their partners with him, or how bad his ex was) without ever showing the perspective of the other side or remorse

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#14935 - 04/26/13 03:02 PM Re: Red Flags [Re: FriedaB]
crocodile Offline
member

Registered: 04/25/13
Posts: 329
That sounds to me less like a psychopath and more like a BPD (borderline personality disorder), not everything but most of it. The problem is that some behaviours of a psychopath overlap with BPD and/or a narcissistic personality disorder and also can make your life hell- the difference is that BPD do it because of their constant inside suffering and paranoia and narcissts often lack understanding and/or empathy but they are still able to feel normal human emotions and have conscience. Psychopaths just don't care. I think the important thing is that psychopaths usually don't hurt themselves or try to commit suicide as BPDs often do - they will maybe occasionally stage it for a show but most do even do that. BPDs are people who themselves need help (whether they are able to take it is another thing) and narcisst can be reformed if they actually feel the pain. Psychopath is irreparable. I think it is important not to label anyone who behaves in a horrible way a psychopath - a lot of people who do horrible things do it because of a mental illness and/or extreme emotional suffering, rather the opposite of the psychopath and confusing the two is actually bad for the former and good for the latter. That's why it's so frustrating that even psychiatrists and psychologists have little awareness about it. In general - a psychopath will never be consciously self-destructive.

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#14936 - 04/26/13 06:13 PM Re: Red Flags [Re: gullablegull]
crocodile Offline
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Registered: 04/25/13
Posts: 329
Quote:
...How long does it take you guys, or is this what I am for the rest of my life? I have focus/concentration problems, memory problems big time, don't trust anyone I meet, and yet I still have to battle the Psychopath in court over the divorce, the fraudulent mortgages, fraudulent prenup, and everything else I was totally unaware of, including the affair. I'm now estranged from family, for they did more harm than good. Any advice would be so appreciated...........I'm Christian, but my intrusive thoughts often interfere with my prayers. Has anyone else had these kind of symptoms from the psychopath aftermath?

It depends on a lot of things: how long you've been in it, how often if at all are you forced to interact with him, is he trying to interact with you and mess you up, your personality and such. I got rid of him just 3 months ago and was getting better daily even though I didn't at first realise what he really was. Luckily, he has a new toy and is moving to another city in the next month so not likely I'll have to see him again and we have no common things/kids and such. I still have nightmares and occasional panic attacks and sometimes I still go back and try to analyse things he was telling me (a lot of them sounded like he really knew deep things about me but then I assume he has just heard it from another woman before and re-used it on me without even understanding) but it is getting better. I'm far from OK though and I guess I'll decide to try some psychologist if I can find a reasonable one. Mostly I feel angry at my own stupidity but it is comforting to read that I'm not the only one and it's not even the stupidity rather the fact that nobody expects a psychopath in their life until they meet one (up until last week I still thought he's like a normal person just with issues and blamed myself for a lot of it.

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#14937 - 04/27/13 01:45 AM Re: Red Flags [Re: crocodile]
warrioress Offline
member

Registered: 03/16/13
Posts: 72
Quote:
In general - a psychopath will never be consciously self-destructive.


This is not true. Because they have no fear, they are often self destructive. They may not 'actually' commit suicide but threaten it, the impulsive behaviors like drinking/driving, breaking things, openly threatening people, domestic abuse, are all self destructive. The problem is, they are so manipulative they rarely get 'caught out'. This makes them even worse. They turn tears on and off, schmooze judges and cops, and generally get away with actual murder.

IE: I had mine arrested at my house for domestic assault, breaking my home and walls apart, pouring red wine all over my home and clothes, interfering with a 911 call by pushing me down in fear of MY LIFE in my BACK Field when I ran away, not even at the house, thinking he might snap my neck right then. He was arrested completely Drunk, with no shoes. The Judge dismissed the case, WITH Prejudice in three days ( which meant the DA could not bring the case again, they were livid) but to make it worse, the Sheriff transported him to my home to pick up his car, which I had been trying to get towed off the property , to no avail because I RENT.

Ok understand this: The Sheriffs DEPT transported a known abuser, to the abused property. I guess they felt sorry for him. I guess that fuckwit judge did too, when a few moths later they were called in again for 'blacked out drunk stalking', with an infant child next door.

The 'no fear' aspect of a psychopath is very important to understand. It makes them better than most at manipulations, because no one can 'Actually Believe' anyone would be so Blatant and self destructive. Mine even punched out a guy in jail and got away with that and everything he did to me too.
Theyre just good at it. It's unexplainable the hypnotic nature of it on mostly EVERYONE, judges and cops alike.

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#14959 - 04/27/13 08:36 AM Re: Red Flags [Re: warrioress]
Shayna Offline
member

Registered: 03/05/13
Posts: 120
Sorry Crocodile... I'm dealing with a narcissist and I believe you're wrong on a couple points (mostly right though):
One, they have no conscience or empathy. Two, they cannot be "reformed". I think the second point is very important since they can be so manipulative and they can convince you that they really can change when they can't. They just keep fooling people to returning to the relationship, and eventually it'll end the same way over and over, getting worse and worse each time. I don't want to give anyone reading this any false hope that their narc can change- they need to know the best scenario is to leave their narc and go no contact.

Also- it's true, narcissists do feel the same feelings we do but they often don't feel them the same way we do. They don't have the 'normal' reactions to things people with empathy and a conscience do. Often their feelings are centered around rage, anger and humiliation, and are often exaggerated and explosive.


Edited by Shayna (04/27/13 08:42 AM)

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#14968 - 04/28/13 10:43 AM Re: Red Flags [Re: warrioress]
crocodile Offline
member

Registered: 04/25/13
Posts: 329
Quote:
This is not true. Because they have no fear, they are often self destructive.

Well, I probably did not formulate this right - they won't do anything with an intension to harm themselves or they won't sacrifice anything for somebody (like I can't picture a psychopath going into a flaming house to save a baby unless he sees some thrill in it for himself). That they will do things which ultimately prove self destructive because they did not think about/feared the consequences - this I do believe. Problem is, sometimes it can be difficult to tell what their intensions were. In general when I think back at my experiences -everything what he did can be explained away, it's only the full pattern that makes sense (I guess that's why it is so difficult for anyone who is not "close" to the guy to believe it - they only see some pieces of the puzzle). I guess the best to recognise the guy is when he loses control over his tongue and starts bragging - then they say really horrendous things (but then usually you have no witnesses and the guy will later say it was a joke or sth like that). I sometimes feel there is no way to fight them in real life...

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#14969 - 04/28/13 10:57 AM Re: Red Flags [Re: Shayna]
crocodile Offline
member

Registered: 04/25/13
Posts: 329
Quote:
I'm dealing with a narcissist and I believe you're wrong on a couple points (mostly right though):
One, they have no conscience or empathy. Two, they cannot be "reformed".

Well, then your narcisst is also a psychopath - as I said, they can overlap. I know a person who is a narcisst but he also has normal feelings and if treated properly can reform. You can also have a psychopath who does not (on the outside at least) behave like a narcisst - my Psychopath was like that, he would play humble and occasionally express self-doubt, at least when there were others around to listen. I guess it is all a matter of definition, you can never entirely understand what's going on in somebody else's mind (and sometimes this person may not understand either), so the question is where to draw a line... I don't know what the psychopaths can and cannot feel, I guess they do feel some stuff (frustration and anger for sure judging from mine). I feel all confused with it because I'd love to know (I guess those who had their psychopath actually say who they are are the lucky ones) but I guess it's best for me to accept this guy is just a toxic a... and move on, whether he has some remnants of humanity or not. I guess if he has they will bite him back sometime and if not, well you can't win boxing with an android...

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#14970 - 04/28/13 11:11 AM Re: Red Flags [Re: crocodile]
crocodile Offline
member

Registered: 04/25/13
Posts: 329
One more red flag I remembered - I had once a situation when a friend of mine had a respiratory problem - she couldn't breath properly, was pale and afraid she will collapse and stop breathing at all. She came to me when I was sitting with the Psychopath and asked for help. I was totally frightened and a bit panicked and wondered if I should call the ambulance or just take her out to fresh air or sth else. Psychopath was just sitting there calmly and gave some BS advice like he knew exactly what is wrong but did not move to even try to help her. I had to ask him to call the taxi for us to take her to the hospital and when he did it he simply turned around and got back to his work (I don't remember if he somehow half heartedly asked if he should go with us but if so it was not very convincing). He also didn't call later to ask how she was (he obviously didn't go with us), he just asked me on the next day if she was fine. All that time he showed not emotion or real concern, it felt more like he was just asking because he knew he should or like it was some sensational event that happened rather than a real threat to somebody's life. At the time I attributed it to a different reaction to stress (freeze rather than fight/run) but now when I think about it he was really cool all the time and showed little concern even after the immediate stress should have been long gone.

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