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#2322 - 09/01/04 06:03 PM Re: My story [Re: Dianne E.]
Dianne E. Offline

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Registered: 11/15/02
Posts: 2788
Loc: United States
Butterfly
(member)
08/31/04 03:45 PM

My Story-Part Two

I have been reading the posts on this forum for the past few months after I discovered that the man I was involved with was a P. I want to share my story and I am sure that some of you will find similarities in your stories with your P. I no longer have any contact with my P and although it was difficult at first, many nights and days of crying, I am thankful that it ended when it did and that the only real damage done was my broken heart(although that was damage enough)

My involvement with my P began about 2 years ago, although I had known him as a friend over 30 years ago in high school. We re-connected through a reunion site where he had left his e-mail address.During our high school years, he lived across the street from me and we would hang out together at the high school radio station. On occassion, he would offer me a ride to school and I would accept and then sometimes we would hang out in his backyard and have conversations about everything from ghosts, seances to my boyfriend problems. He was such a willing listener and fascinating talker and I enjoyed his company, but there was no romantic feelings on my part.

Throughout the years, I would look through my yearbook and wonder what had happened to my friends and I would pause at the his picture and wonder where life had led him. When I saw his e-mail address on the reunion website, I sent an e-mail to him, asking him that exact question, never really expecting a response. But lo and behold, the next day there was a response from him.He told me that he was divorced after 22 years of marriage, had 5 kids, 2 of them died very young and was a grandfather of 6.He lived in the southwest and loved it. That was unfortunate since I still lived on the east coast so we wouldn't be seeing one another very soon. We exchanged e-mails every day for a few weeks and then I asked him if we could chat on line. He was very happy to set up an IM account and then every night, we would chat on line, sometimes in the afternoon after I got home from work too. He told me about his interesting life...he was a managing editor of a newspaper, a private investigator and installed alarm systems in casinos. During one of our on-line chats, I told him how I was negotiating a divorce settlement and that my husband was being very selfish about money. He offered to buy my house and then I would pay him some ridiculous amount per month to buy the house from him.(That never happened, thank goodness.) He later told me that he was a millionaire and that he wanted to make sure that I was not taking advantage of him because of his money. He even told me that his money was my money and if I ever needed any, just ask.(No, I didn't ask him for money, although he did pay for some of my trips to visit him) He also owned a twin engine plane and had my name painted on the side of it. He even sent me a picture of it through the wonders of the computer. Then during another one of our on-line chats, he told me that he had a confession to make. he said that all his friends told him not to tell me, that he might scare me away, but he didn't want to lose this chance. He lost it once in high school and now that he was being given a second chance, he didn't want to blow it. He told me that ever since high school that he had had a crush on me. He has thought about me constantly all these years, even in Vietnam when he was part of the Special Forces team. I had always been his first love the first time he saw me in a plaid skirt in high school. He told me that he never asked me out because he was too shy and why would I, this beautiful, wonderful young lady want to go out with a geek like him.I was flabberghasted! I had no idea that he had had feelings for me. We continued to chat and send daily e-mails. His e-mails were so romantic, told me that he would love me "forever and a day." He also played the guitar and had a lovely voice and would send me romantic songs as well as e-cards. I was falling in love with him. We also spoke daily on the phone and were anxious to see one another after all these years. He told me that he didn't want a committment from me until we met in person. That opportunity arrived when he said that he was coming to the east coast in October to tape a program about a murder he had investigated. The taping session was supposedly scheduled for a Sunday and he wanted me there by his side. That taping never took place..he told me that he would rather spend the time with me so he cancelled it. Throughout our year together, he would occassionally mention about how the show would call and want him to re-schedule the taping. Probably all lies.It seemed rather odd to me that this show would call when he just happened to be here with me.

Anyway, my friend came with me to meet him at the airport. I was too nervous and excited to drive. Being the romantic and sentimentalist that I am, I gave him 2 roses, one being yellow, representing our friendship and one red, representing our new found love. We had a fantastic weekend together. He was everything that I had ever wanted in a relationship..quite the gentleman. He always opened my car door and made me get back into the car if I opened it, took my family and my Mom out to this wonderful restaurant. He was so very charming and insisted upon holding my hand wherever we went, told me that this was his dream come true, to have me in his life.What woman wouldn't swoon over this man?(One who knew that it was too good to be true)That Saturday night we were in his hotel room and I knew that I loved him and wanted to be with him the rest of my life. He had already declared his love and devotion to me. When we had gotten to the car after picking him up from the airport, he gave me a silver ring with a garnet that he told me that he had especially made(with his own hands) for me. I immediately put it on my left ring finger and it fit exactly. How did he know? So I wanted to give him something that would represent the love and devotion I had for him. I gave him my high school ring and told him that if we had been in high school, this is what I would have given him, so I was giving it to him now to show him how much he means to me and how much I love him.(I have never seen that ring again.

I requested that he return it through e-mails, a letter and phone messages. I even sent him a stamped self-addressed envelope so all he had to do was put the ring in it and put it in a mailbox.This was one of the many proofs that I knew that I was dealing with an evil man. How dare he keep something that is sentimental to me??)

This is getting a bit too long so I will end here and continue another time. I thank you all for listening and I am thankful that this forum exists although I am sad that it has to exist, for all of us who have been victimized by a P.

Butterfly



recovery
(member)
09/01/04 02:59 PM

Re: My Story-Part Two [re: Butterfly]

Hi Butterfly

Welcome to the forum. So far your P sounds like prince charming - but I sense red flags are being waved. Hope you will continue your story when you can.

Best regards

Recovery

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#2323 - 09/11/04 04:18 PM Re: My story [Re: Dianne E.]
Dianne E. Offline

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Registered: 11/15/02
Posts: 2788
Loc: United States
Butterfly

09/11/04 03:35 PM

My Story-Part 2

I am sorry that it has taken me so long to get back to complete my story. With school starting and getting adjusted to the new schedule...I am sure that many of you know how it goes.

So to continue....that first weekend was wonderful.His son (unexpectedly) drove down from upstate to visit and we spent the day together. Even visited our old neighborhood and our alma mater. At the airport he proposed to me and I accepted. he promised me that he would propose properly as soon as my ex and I signed the settlement papers and he kept that promise many months later.December, I flew out to where he lived (or should I say his temporary home at a residential hotel since he told me that he had sold his house. He was planning on moving to my area as soon as he took care of some business) for his birthday.He picked me up from the airport in a limo!(the limo was just for that one ride. He had an inexpensive compact car and it didn't even have a CD player in it and this man claimed he was a millionaire? What was I thinking???)with a dozen red roses!It was a very romantic weekend, showed me the sights of his state, saw where he worked. One night we had champagne and popcorn in front of a fireplace while he played his guitar and sang love songs to me.:::sigh::: Christmas came and he came here on the 26th. He met my family and it was an enjoyable time.That following weekend, we drove upstate to visit his son and his family as well as one of his daughters and all 6 grandchildren!I suggested that we bring gifts or something, but he felt that it was unnecessary.Thought that was rather odd, but knowing who he is now, it wasn't strange at all.The visit was nice, but he seemed somewhat estranged from his kids and grandkids. He gave me the impression in our conversations that he was very close to his kids. His actions indicated otherwise. It was if he didn't know how to interact with them,but tried to make it seem as if he was close to them and knew what was going on in their lives for my benefit.Supposedly his kids loved me,so he told me after we left.We spent the rest of the week together doing things and spent New Year's Eve together at my friend's house.He left New Year's Day. January, we kept up with daily phone conversations and e-mails.He was involved in a murder trial as an expert witness so his move out here was delayed, didn't know how long the trial would take. I flew out to see him in February. Then in April, the trial was finished and he was on his way. He was driving out here, straight through, just stopping on the road to rest.It should take him about 2 1/2 days and he should be here on a Saturday. Well, at a rest stop, he was rear-ended by a little old lady and alot of damage was done to his car. He was in a remote town and so he would have to have the car towed and wait for parts. That took a few days since it was the weekend.Days went by, we spoke on the phone and finally he was on his way again, but he got a message from his Mom. His sister, in California had a brain aneurysm and they wanted him to be there. So off to California he flew.

Perhaps I should just get to the quick about all this. Alot of things he told me were lies after speaking with another woman he was involved with. This is where I should spend my energies on my story. I think by now, you see that he presented himself as a romantic to me,he presented himself exactly as I wanted him to be; always there for me, would call whenever I text him, he would call me back. He listened to my tales of woe about my soon to be ex and was very supportive. For 12 months I was in this fairytale romance...we even discussed writing our book how we met again after 30 years and fell in love.(Told me he had an agent and published a book. The published book was true, but he doesn't have an agent...published it through a vanity press and it was not well written from what I have read.)His mask started falling a long time ago, but I had blinders on and was somewhat in denial, but about a year after we met,there were too many unbelievable stories and he wasn't paying attention to me like he used to. The phone calls were less frequent, most weekends, I hardly heard from him anymore. There were excuses of why he didn't call,no signal(he had a cell phone, no home phone)why he couldn't come and visit or why I couldn't come visit him,meetings he had to attend, even after he had promised that we would see one another every two weeks. And then reality slapped me in the face and the first time I still wanted to believe what he said. I received an e-mail from a woman I had no idea of who she was. In the e-mail, she had said that she was able to break into this man's account and copied and pasted e-mails that he had sent. They were e-mails to other women, e-mails about meeting them, telling them that he loved them, was so happy that they were in his life and all signed with "Love,". I confronted him about the e-mails and he told me that it was a jealous woman who wanted to date him but he wouldn't because they worked in the same office and he also said that these e-mails happened shortly after he put my picture on his desk.That the e-mails were sent to everyone in his address book including his Mom and corporate headquarters and he had the FBI investigating it. I believed his story. I visited him after that e-mail and all seemed ok, not as wonderful as it once was.He seemed distant at times and would disappear for longer periods of time saying that he had to use the bathroom or get something to drink.(He was calling the other women on his cell phone) That weekend in October was the last time I saw him, although I didn't know it at the time. That weekend, we discussed how I would move out there in February and that he would be here when I talked with my ex and my sons about the move. He never came out for that weekend. The first weekend he couldn't come because he had an emergency meeting with his boss.The following weekend he had the flu and was too sick. I had the conversation with the boys and my ex anyway and after talking with them, decided that moving right now was not the best thing to do.I didn't hear from him all day sunday and left numerous phone messages. I was concerned since he had a heart condition and the flu could cause complications. I wanted to make sure he was ok, so I looked up a co-worker's name in the white pages and decided to call him. When I told the story and asked him to check up on him, he told me that he was a big boy and could take care of himself. And anyway, he was in Arizona.

I said Arizona? He is supposed to be here with me. The co-worker asked"Where's here?" I told him and he told me that I would have to discuss that with him. I decided to go on line and check my e-mail to see if he had left a message. There was a message, but not from him. It was from a different woman asking if I knew this man and if I was involved with him. She happened to be on line and IMed(instant messaged)me, asking the same questions. Apparently her friend was involved with him and she had some suspicions and hired a private investigator. She told me that he was in ARIZONA with YET another woman!She gave me the phone number of her friend and encouraged me to call her since her friend also needed confirmation that we were talking about the same man. That night I spent an hour talking with her.She met him through an internet dating service and he moved in 2 weeks ago and they were engaged.
Over the next few weeks, I talked with another woman he dated. A few months after that I was contacted by a woman who he had lived with for 3 years and who he was also engaged to. She had the most information about his life. While seeing me and living with her, he was married to his second wife. He told me that he was only married once. I am aware of at least 6 women he was involved with and was engaged to at least 3 of us. He met them all through different internet dating websites. I was the only one who had known him in person before, although I contacted him through the internet. I sometimes wonder if he knew that I would contact him by leaving his e-mail address on the website. Anyway, he continued the lie about the flu, leaving me a message Monday morning that he had stayed home and to call him on his cell phone.I didn't want to talk to him quite yet. The second message, he left he obviously had spoken to his co-worker and the other woman. He adamantly denied that he was in Arizona and that he didn't know who the woman was but he knew that I had spoken to her and to call him so we could discuss it. He mentioned the woman by name so how couldn't he have known her and how did he know that I had spoken to her???(The mask was off!)He left a third message putting the blame on me saying that I hadn't returned his calls, so he just wouldn't bother me anymore.How crazy was that!!! This man tells me that his lifelong dream was to have my love and me as his wife and then leaves a message that he won't bother me anymore?Without any sort of explanation?I would think that if he loved me so much, first of all he wouldn't have been involved with so many women and secondly, he would have been on the next plane to beg for my forgiveness!Later that afternoon I called him and he didn't realize it was me who was calling. He didn't sound like he had the flu.When he realized it was me all of a sudden he is saying "Hello? hello? anybody there?" as if he lost signal. Then he hung up and when I called back, I got his voicemail. We spoke a few times after that. I left a voicemail to wish him a Happy Birthday...sentimentalist that I am. He returned my call, thanking me saying that besides his son, I was the only one to call. He called me around the holidays to tell me to enjoy the holidays and then my last phone conversation was in January when I told him that I would like to talk about what had happened. He asked me if I wanted him to fly here and I told him that I wanted to fly to where he was. He explained how it was a long drive from the airport and I told him that I knew, I had researched it, but before we could make any firm plans, he lost signal and we never spoke again. For a few weeks, I left a message asking him to call. I know I am fortunate that he hasn't called or contacted me. I have accepted that I will never hear from him again and hope to never hear from him again. I had hoped, at first, that I could "save" him; that I was special enough, that he truly loved me, that I could change his ways and that we would live happily ever after. After researching Ps and reading this board, I have realized that that is never going to happen!It had been real difficult for me for a few months...all those broken promises, all those unfulfilled dreams. I felt as if my life was snatched away from me and that I would never be happy again. It has been about 10 months since his mask fully came off. I am happy in my life and have gained from this experience. I still think about him. I will always wonder why, knowing that I will probably never know.

I have benefitted from reading the forums here. I feel for all of you who are still involved with a P or have been involved with a P.I think it is extremely important that the public be aware of the Ps who walk among us. Thank you for listening and thank you to all who contribute to this forum.

Butterfly (new life)

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#2324 - 09/16/04 09:51 AM Re: My story [Re: Dianne E.]
Dianne E. Offline

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Posts: 2788
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Nan

09/12/04 01:31 AM

Re: My Story-Part 2 [re: Butterfly] Edit Reply

Dear Butterfly,

Thank you for writing about your experience.

Your long and sad story reads like a textbook case about the socially adept psychopath. As I was reading, I was sure that you would come to a part about how he borrowed money from you that he never paid back, or how he outright defrauded you with some far-out money scheme, but it seems he never did that, which would have been par for the course.

The P I knew, would go shopping with me and would for example, and in spite of the fact that I do not drink liquor, suggest buying a horribly expensive $100.00 bottle og Cognac or some very expensive wine. When we had to pay, he had always forgotten his wallet..." Honey, I have forgotten my wallet at home. I'll pay you the minute we get home." So I paid, but he never did and I was too embarrassed, too reticent not to mention, too stupid, to remind him of the money. He used this trick more than once. I kept thinking that he must simply have forgotten to pay me - I excused him. For every little thing that he gave me, I paid a hundred times over.

Although you must have been reeling with the discovery, you are fortunate that you relatively quickly discovered what he was up to. I know just how difficult it is to be confronted with the truth and I also understand why you initially wanted to believe his long and detailed explanation about how, what, where and why. It is very human to want to believe in a long cherished dream and no one is as good at "making dreams come true" than a socially adept P.

You seem to be healing from this emotionally draining experience. Your input is valuable and can help other people and I hope that you will continue to post here.

Take good care,

Nan

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#2325 - 09/16/04 09:58 AM Re: My story [Re: Dianne E.]
Dianne E. Offline

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Registered: 11/15/02
Posts: 2788
Loc: United States
talia
(member)
09/16/04 08:56 AM

just want to cry and cry and cry...

I will share my story later.
but this relationship ended in July..last week was when I made the discovey that he was either NPD..or some type soem type of psychopath..is there a difference?

anyway..I just can't seem to get on with my own recovery..I just want to stay in bed and hide....


Dianne E.
(member)
09/16/04 09:49 AM

Re: just want to cry and cry and cry... [re: talia]

Hi talia, welcome to the forum. There is a difference. The dividing line is a Psychopath doesn't have a conscience and is a mixed bag of N's etc.

I am moving this thread to the "My Story" section and will look forward to hearing more about your story when you feel comfortable.

Di

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#2326 - 09/16/04 12:05 PM Re: My story [Re: Dianne E.]
Nan Offline
member

Registered: 01/12/04
Posts: 501
Hi Talia,

Welcome, I am glad you found us.

I know how tempting the stay-in-bed syndrome feels to you right this moment.

Get out from under the covers. Put on big, warm and cosy terry cloth rope. Make a soothing cup of tea, put it on a tray and take it into the living room. Find your favorite chair and cuddle up with the tea while watching the night sky. Watch the stars and remember your dreams.

There is life after the P. I promise you.

Warm thoughts,

Nan


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#2327 - 09/17/04 05:10 PM Re: My story [Re: Dianne E.]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Nan,
Yes, I was fortunate that he never borrowed money from me, but he did default on reimbursing me or paying for my divorce attorney that he so sincerely said that he would do. There were times when I would book a flight to see him and put it on my credit card. He told me that he would reimburse me, but I never saw the money. I wouldn't bring it up too often, I trusted that he would pay me, but when I did, he would casually ask what the amount was and said that he would get the money out right away. He also volunteered to pay my divorce attorney(I was already in the process of getting a divorce, so I wasn't getting a divorce in order to be with the P)My lawyer even met him once and the P gave him his business card and told my lawyer to send the bill to him. My lawyer said that he would do whatever I told him to do. Later, after the mask was removed, I spoke with my lawyer and he told me that he felt there just wasn't something right about the man. He never expected him to pay. Unfortunately, since I trusted this P so much and he told me that I would never have to worry about money again, I settled for less in my divorce settlement than what I could have gotten. Fortunately, my lawyer still was looking out for my best interests and convinced me to still make sure that I could live with the settlement, financially, no matter what happened with this man. I am thankful for that. Although I was not taken for money, one of the women that he had lived with for 3 years was. The woman and I began corresponding through e-mails after I had my last conversation with the P back in January. Last summer, she had gotten him a credit card in his name, but under her account with the intention of marrying soon and combining all their assets. Well this P proceeded to use the credit card to entertain his women, myself included. Hotel rooms, restaurant bills, gifts for me,and airfare to the tune of over $20,000. She has sued him and won a judgement in her favor, but he has repeatedly ignored any legal papers, phone calls or letters sent to him. He also moved to another state, so she has hired a lawyer from that state to pursue the matter. I wish her luck in collecting, but he seems to get away with everything.
Part of the reason why I think that I have handled this emotional experience so well has been the support of my 4 sons, my Mom and my friends. I also believe that they are part of the reason why this P was unmasked so quickly in addition to the e-mails from the other women. I think the P may have seen that his mask was unraveling under the scrutiny of my family and especially my best friend. Although I wanted to believe in his stories, they would question him and me and made me see how there were so many inconsistencies and lies. I am so grateful for my family and friends being there for me when I needed them the most.
My life is good. I try to follow the attitude of making the best of the situation. My one year with the P was certainly a learning experience and it was fun in alot of ways. I visited places I had never been before and for a while there, was treated like a Princess,(he even called me Princess) but as we know all fairytales come to an end, but this one did not end "happily ever after."
I feel for those of you who are or who were involved with a P who is physically,emotionally and/or verbally abusive. I hope that you gain strength and support from this forum. I hope that someday there is more awareness of the danger of the Ps who live among us.
Butterfly

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#2328 - 09/29/04 08:06 PM Re: My story
Dianne E. Offline

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Registered: 11/15/02
Posts: 2788
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Shunyata
(member)
09/29/04 06:59 PM

I am new here . . .

Hi there.....I may have stumbled on a website that can help me. I think I am married to a psychopath. He had a terribly abusive father and both verbal and physical abuse is a part of our marriage. He is from the UK and we have had some help with this, but only some community marriage counselling and he also went to a very silly psychotherapist who told him violence is a part of intimacy, (both in the UK). In 1998 I had a completely non-related accident and have been unwell since. I have been diagnosed with post-concussional syndrome and post-traumatic fibromyalgia and have had some cognitive issues to deal with. I have had much healing however and even with the issues I deal with - I am positive. I am an ordained minister and a teacher/writer. I have taught personal development and various aspects of spirituality internationally and at colleges. I am a meditator with an uncommon lack of attachment in my life. I am well educated and have done extensive travel. That is me.....then there is my husband.....also a charming and intelligent person.......he slips, seemingly unrealised by him, into very dark times. During these times he is mean and not only heartless, I do not think he is at all mindful of it happening. Oddly enough, the cycles do seem to (often) coinside with a full moon. He usually only becomes verbally abusive. He was physically abusive in two relationships before ours. I have found remarkable tools for addressing the verbal abuse. We have shortened the verbally abusive cycles considerably. However, in the first months of our marriage,(we were friends for three years before we married and I did not see signs of psychopathic behaviour before we were married), he suddenly became violent. There were three separate incidences of voilence toward me in a 6th month period. This was followed by the counselling, etc, we went through as mentioned above. It was more our spirituality with a strong Eastern influences (Buddhism, Reiki and other aspects), that helped to heal the patterns. I have a background in behavioural sciences and this has helped. We have experienced, both together and separatly, a myriad of spiritual happenings that have helped. I know he is intent upon healing. But in the midst of one of these cycles, none of that matters. I do not matter. I become his target. In the last four months, it has turned voilent again and this on top of much success in our lives. Now, again, after six years of no voilence, this is heartbreaking.

He and I have talked about this quite a lot. He says he does not have remorse and does not care when in the midst of it. He does not seem to care for days or possibly weeks following. He does not react positively to comments and situations which he normally would. Years later, he does not see it as wrong, even though anyone else doing it to their partner, would be an "idiot". It seems as if one day its all forgotten and he is back to "normal". He does not have a conscious about it. He can wistle like a song.....and the only time he wistles is during one of these periods! It is sad though amazing.

I think he shut part of his development off very early. He has no innner child, his play is skydiving. He also very much enjoys voilent video games.

In writing it is my hope to learn somethings here and to find support. Thanks for reading this. My best, Shunyata

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#2329 - 09/29/04 08:08 PM Re: My story [Re: Dianne E.]
Dianne E. Offline

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Registered: 11/15/02
Posts: 2788
Loc: United States
Hi Shunyata, welcome to the forum. I hope you will find the answers to the questions you have.

I have combined your therapy thread with an existing one and bumped it up so that you can read what Dr. Hare has to say about the effects of therapy.

Best Wishes,

Di

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#2330 - 09/30/04 01:51 AM Re: My story [Re: Dianne E.]
Nan Offline
member

Registered: 01/12/04
Posts: 501
Hi Shunyata,

Welcome to the forum.

Off hand, I would say that the symptoms you describe sound like some form of psychopathy or antisocial behaviour. The odd part is the fact that his episodes are few and very far between. You write that the first three years you knew each other, you saw NO behaviour that indicated anything abnormal. Were you then aware of the physical abuse issues in his other relationships? Did these happen during the period when you were friends? Do you know?

Is there any way that you can contact these women? It could be very helpful both to you and to them if could gently discuss your husbands past and present behaviour. Helful to you, because it may give you important clues, and very helpful to them, because they may wery well never have understood what happened and why. Presupposing that your husband is a psychopath, his former partners may still be in a state because they may never have understood what kind of person they were up against.

Then three months into the marriage he became abusive and violent. Three months appear to be the length of time that many, though not all, psychopaths can maintain the Mask of Sanity.

How long have you been married and how often does he enter into these negative cycles?

Have you read Robert Hare's book, Without Conscience. He describes many different aspects of psychopathy. He also suggests that a diagnosis cannot be made without thorough testing by a psychiatrist.

However, it sounds as though you must have read some books or articles on the subject. This is important, because it provides understanding and allows for knowledge of a state of mind, whose origin is still poorly understood. So far, there is no known cure and, as you write, it also seems that therapy can worsen the condition.

The above is merely preamble for the real problem for you is how to cope with your husband when he is in one of his negative cycles. You write that you, "have found remarkable tools for addressing the verbal abuse."

That is not easy to do. Can you explain what these tools are and how it helps you or your husband? Knowing what works for you could be very helpful to other posters.

What kind of support are you getting from your family and your friends? One of our posters, TOCATTA, have written a very interesting article on the subject of support or rather the lack of it. She describes how difficult it is to adequately explain to non-victims why a psychopath or Covert Aggressive (CA, her label of choice, can make you feel like Alice in upside down Wonderland.

You mention your spirituality:

"It was more our spirituality with a strong Eastern influences (Buddhism, Reiki and other aspects),..."

I know a little about Tibetan Buddhism and Reiki. I have also practiced Aikido for many years The other aspects you mention "could" be yoga. I am guessing! As you may be aware, there are different types of yoga. One advanced type is Kundalini yoga. I am not personally familiar with Kundalini yoga. I do know that practising this specific type of yoga "can" produce psychotic episodes if the person is not suffciently clear and balanced or helped by a teacher who is properly tuned into the student. I merely mention this for your consideration. So-called recreational drugs of any kind, as well as certain types of psychotropic medications can also produce psychotic episodes.


While still not conclusive, CURRENT research indicate that psychopathy could be a blend of nature and nurture. That each one by itself is not enough to produce psychopathy. It may be genetic but that alone is not thought to be the decisive factor. A negative social childhood environment may be the trigger IF the person has a genetic predisposition. It is still very speculative! As you may be aware, psychiatry is ever changing its paradigms and what was thought to be true fifty years ago, is no longer valid.

It is important to be aware that there is no doubt that psychopaths exists and that their behaviour cause untold pain and suffering to the world around them. They, however, appear very little, if at all affected, by he pandemonium they create. They seem blissfully unaware of ever having behaved in a fashion that is detrimental to others. When told, they feel no remorse and are inclined to blame the other for the negative consequences. They do not see or observe cause and effect and it is never their fault.

Please take care and write again.

Regards,

Nan







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#2331 - 09/30/04 07:09 AM Re: My story [Re: Dianne E.]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Shunyata,

Welcome.

I am impressed by how mindfully you are dealing with your situation through these different approaches and strategies. I hope you will find much support from this forum, but I sense you have much to contribute too. I look forward to your future posts.

Please could you elaborate on this statement?:

“I am a meditator with an uncommon lack of attachment in my life.”


Regarding your references to the UK(!):

Given the way you describe you husband, I would be more inclined to believe that his thinking has contorted or taken out of context what the psychologist said to him, than that a qualified psychologist would state emphatically that “violence is a part of intimacy”.

It is accepted in the fields of psychiatry and psychology that intimacy elicits violence in some individuals. Of course you can carelessly contract that to ‘Intimacy elicits violence.’ which said another way = ‘Violence is a part of intimacy.’.

Of course you could be right and this could be a malpracticing psychologist, but I can think of two explanations as to why your husband might think this way:

1) such thinking in itself supports that thought disorders might be present ~ it is not true and so since he evidently believes it, it is also possibly a delusion.
2) Psychopathic behaviour responds negatively to therapy – this could be a good example.

In saying all of this, I should point out that I am English (LOL), and I do not know of any official evidence to suggest that psychologists in the UK are anymore prone to malpractice than in other countries.

When things started to deteriorate with my P I also projected the blame on the cultural difference between us. Now, other than that Axis 1 disorders (which includes delusion disorders and schizophrenia) are more prevalent in immigrant populations, I do not think that our different cultures explain the dynamics that we have experienced.

I associate greatly with your descriptions of your cycles, their irregularity, and this comment "During these times he is mean and not only heartless, I do not think he is at all mindful of it happening". I have experience something very similar with my P in that the psychopathic element seems to be intermittent, and subconcious (he is not aware he has acted psychopathically, and when he is psychopathic, he is not aware that he has ever been nice).

Originally I was blinkered by the abuse and the threat of violence and believed him to be a P, now I think Narcissistic Personality Disorder has progressed via splits in his personality into Schizophrenia, with him acting psychopathically and psychotically in his black moods better explains what has been afflicting our relationship.

Because of the similarities between our experiences Shunyata (I will go into detail if you request me to) , if you have not done so, I suggest you start with investigating Schizophrenia and Narcissistic Personality Disorder.

I found R.D. Laing’s, “The Divided Self” very helpful in relating to what was happening to P and how he was treating me.

I have also found Maggie Scarf’s work on intimate partners very informative.

Best regards

KT

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