The purpose of this forum is to discuss relationships with Psychopaths in the family.

I often wonder what life in the early days of a Psychopath must have been like. The more I read, the more I lean toward the nature reason for Psychopaths.

Please reserve this area for immmediate family members of Psychopaths. It is my guess that the pain of a parent dealing with a Psychopath for a child/adult must be a horrible pain to suffer. Your child is always your child, the question is how do you deal with this same child/adult if they are a Psychopath?

What were some of the things that seemed "odd" when the child was young? I am finding more articles on children who go on rampages and kill classmates, what about the rest of them that don't kill?

Sorry for rambling on, these are questions I have been thinking about.

Di

Hi all, I am new here, its nice to have a place where you can relate with others who live and deal with psychopaths. I am pretty sure my first born is one. We have not gotten along ever since she became a teenager. She dropped out of school and for the past 10 years has drifted in and out of several relationships. Going for guys with perferably with rich parents. She never worked and been involved in the drug trade. She has been arrested for theft and five years ago was in a high spped police car chase where she smashed up her ankle and still has 6 or 7 pins in it. Last Oct she asked if she could move back home to have her ankle fixed and I regretably said yes. She was staying up all night and would wake up in a horrid mood about 4pm. I thought she was addicted to cocaine. Her behaviour was erratic laughing the crying, she was paranoid,always thinking someone was stealing her things, it was really crazy. Her brothers wanted to move out, just nuts man. Two weeks before Christmas called 911 after she pushed me into a coffee table, yousee she thinks that all her problems are my fault. Police took her away and she was tranfered to the mental hospital on a form 1, 48 hour assessment. After they learned that she had yeilded an axe at her brother they kept her. A couple of days before Christmas she pleaded to come home. I went to see her doctor but he could not tell me what her problem is, she is 26. So what do you think, any response would be appreciated

Treefrog,
Welcome to the forum, Sorry to hear that. It must be very painfull if it is your own child. It sounds like it could be, butI probably there is more to it. Have you been able to talk to her ever since she is in the hospital?

Hi Hopefull, thank you for responding, she has been home since a couple of days before Christmas, I mean what could I do, I brought her into this world, I feel responsible. I looked up her medication on the net and it said it was a anti-psychotic. With more research and some help from her social worker I can tell her mood swings and instead of lashing out she rethinks the situation. She has been told that it will only take one phone call and she's back at the hospital. That's my edge, and so far it's working. Di asked about symptoms with children, Miss always wanted things her way and would do anything to get what she wanted. One of my first indications that this girl had a problem was when she slept at a girlfriend's house and her Mom called me the next day, she was missing jewellry. Does anyone know if this is an illness that is passed down genetically?

Treefrog,

Is there any history in your family of similar cases? Some psychologist say it is genetic, you are born with it, or that it is learned. I can't remember the websites, but there was one doctor that talks about it, I ll try to look for it for you. I am sure that a mother will do anything for her child. If she takes anti-psychotic she must be in bad shape. I am sure you can find support in your community for you to learn how deal with it. Talk about it would surely help you.

Thanks again Hopefull, there has been no such cases on my side of the family but maybe on mates. Its so hard to get personal information. As for the community there just doesn't seem to be enough help, lack of staff and resourses but that won't stop me. I love to research

Hi again, does anybody know if its okay to smoke cannabis while taking anti-psychotic medication?

Treefrog,

I read in an article on a scyzophrenic that cannabis can cause psychosis and can enhance psychosis if already present, even an extreme dosis of coffee can cause psychosis. Mixing it with medication is surely not great. so it is definitively not good.

Treefrog,
Welcome to the forum. It has been a safe haven for me.
Between the forum, my research and talking with countless
people on the subject of psychopathy the one thing that
I have learned is how difficult it is to arrive at a definitive label of anyone's condition when we are dealing
within this arena. It sounds to me, in my limited knowledge,
that your daughter may very well be suffering from a variety
of conditions and disorders. I would think that the only way to help her (or to at the very least understand her completely) would be to have her evaluated by a competent, knowledgable and well versed clinical psychologist... a
secialist. Perhaps this means taking her to a larger city
where one is available.
In any event, you have described some of the horror stories
that you have had to deal with. I am sure that I can speak
for all of the forum members in saying to you that we feel
for you and that we send you our good energy and prayers to
get through this. Certainly your daughter has "acted out" in
some extremely aggressive ways. Aside from these incedents,
how does her personality fit into the criteria of the psychopath or narcissist ?
Again, welcome to the forum.
Rick

Oh Hopefull I knew it. The girl said she had a note from her doctor that legally allowed her so much a day but if couse wouldn't show me when asked, boy do I have a lot to learn.

Thanks for responding, quite frankly I don't even know what narcissist is, sigh. Green I am. Now if you want to know about Global Warming I could talk for hours. Isn't it funny how topics come up in your life. She fit all 20 symptoms of being a psychopath, and upon thinking about the past the puzzle seemed to come together, for years I have wondered why she behaves the way she does and now I know. But now the challenge begins, right, once you know the problem and if you have a conscience you have to try to fix it right? My biggest barrier is that she is 26 and will only tell me what she wants me to know which is very little. Now she mad at me because I have cought on to the connection between her meds and cannibis. I told her if I found out that the mixture was not good she would not be allowed to smoke it in our house and that made her angry. She has a stare sometimes that reminds me of Scarlett O'Hara. She says she MOVING OUT but has no where to go and no money to do iy with, o boy, lots of research to do, really glad to have found this form and thanks once again for responding

Hi Treefrog
I also wanted to say welcome. I am not able to get to my computer as much as before but have been following your story. I ditto Ricks wise suggestions. I am also glad you are here. . .you will find it a haven of encouragement and support.
finished :-)

Hi finished, thats funny, have felt that way so much after the last few months. But yaknow whenever I figure that I have done nothing right as a Mom to this girl because she has such a talent to put it in my face no matter how distorted, but not in my mind, but guess what happens. Treefrog is my handle for my environmental/community activism, I get involved, to say the least. I am informed that I have been awarded a really presigious award for community involvement and I think to myself. Later, Thank you

Hi treefog,
just wanted to say welcome to the forum. This is a great place to find support and learn about the p.
betterway

Hi Treefrog, welcome to the forum. I believe that Psychopaths are going to turn out the way they do no matter how much a mother tries. It is the old nature vs. nurture theory and I believe it is a evil twist of nature.

>>It is the old nature vs. nurture<<

Very interesting! I hadn't heard that before but how true.

Thanks for that.
finished

Hi all, well days have gone by and haven't learned much. Something is not right here. If I as her mother who has taken this girl back home, I think I should be allowed to talk to her new doctor, wouldn't you think? But no, breach of confidentiality, of privacy. I don't get it.
Things aren't going well. I feel like I am enabling her outlandish behavior. We have a large family and live on one income. It was a few days before pay day and I was short of money, she got a government check, I asked her for half of it she said sure and then went out to the bar, stayed out all night and roped in another victim who brought her home in the morning. She hasn't paid a penny to be here and I have given her what little I had on occassion. Always under the assumption that she would pay it back. Will I ever learn? This time is it however, told her I was going to give her another red cent. She told me I hated her, always have. She takes this medication and smokes a lot of cannibus, she said she has told the doctor but because she lies so much I don't know for sure. She says she is moving to Chicago at months end because she hates it here, I asked her are you going to hitch hike? no response. I dunno.

Hi Treefrog

>>Something is not right here. If I as her mother who has taken this girl back home, I think I should be allowed to talk to her new doctor, wouldn't you think? But no, breach of confidentiality, of privacy. I don't get it.<<

If she is over eighteen they (the doctors) will not tell you anything.

>>I feel like I am enabling her outlandish behavior<<

It sounds like you are coming into an awareness that she is using and abusing you. That's the first step. . .awareness.

>> Will I ever learn? <<

One of the most awesome things I learned in one of my new groups that I am attending (DVIS) is this. Taking abuse is a learned behavior (others train us) BUT it can be UNLEARNED. For me it takes awareness, practice and support. After decades of receiving this kind of treatment (and some from offspring also)I CAN CHANGE IF I CHOOSE TO. I have noticed that my son does not like it but I DO!! And I'm feeling a WHOLE lot less like a victim and martyr.


>>She says she is moving to Chicago at months end because she hates it here, I asked her are you going to hitch hike? no response.<<

If she's of age. . .it might be a blessing (for you). It has been my experience. . .they come back when busted, broke and beat up by the world. My two youngest sons are alcholic/addicts. Enabling is something I have been doing for a very long time in the name of "trying to be a good parent".
My thoughts are with you treefrog. It is not easy when it is a child (no matter how old they are). I also see P behavior in them as well (scary).
finished
>>

Thanks so much finished, how can I get hooked up to DVIS.
I think you are so right, awareness must lead to understanding which should lead to some kind of solution, if it could only be that easy. When I told her she was cut off the money supply she knew exactly what to say, she knew what buttons to push, I am accepting an award at city hall in a few weeks and she said I'll go tell them what an abusive awfull mother that you are and I said ok, go do it with little emotion on the outside but raving on the inside, she is capable of doing it and would, or maybe she wouldn't. A VICTIM, ya man, I know I must be stronger than she, just trying to maintain the balance, I have four sons as well, God give me strength. And ya, she's home only because she has burnt all her bridges, boy oh boy. They say that a lot of people with the P illness live in halfway homes and the like, but funding is being cut, here in Ontario anyway, time to put on some advocate shoes perhaps.

Treefrog

DVIS is Domestice Violence Intervention Services. I called information to get the number.

Betrayed was the one who encouraged me to go and I am forever grateful to her for that. I lost my nerve when I got there for my first appointment and she gently nudged me to go back. That she had had the same experience. I am so glad I did because I am learning WHAT abuse is.

As I shared on some other posts I have been involved with P's and N's all my life. I had developed a very high tolerance for abuse and didn't recognize it as such. Not the physical abuse of course, that's obvious, but the more covert and insidious forms. Emotional, verbal, sexual and the phychological(spelling?) kind.

Several posters also recommended a book called the "Verbally Abusive Relationship". Reading that was a turning point for me. I now see abuse when it's happening pretty clearly and understand the reasons behind it.

The fellowship and group support I receive (and also give) is very healing. It (DVIS)is a 24 week group and after you have completed 24 weeks you move into another group. They are totally dedicated to educating women and helping them get out of abusive situations. They also understand that everyone is at different levels of growth. Some are not emotionally able to leave their abusers. It is a process and as I said it was so liberating for me to hear that tolerating abuse is a learned behavior and can be unlearned if I am willing to do the work. Old habits are hard to break especially for a caretaker like me. I'm growing and getting stronger though. One day at a time.

Betrayed really is the one that encouraged the group thing. I also got into some groups offered by the YWCA. We have a wondeerful womens center here and they offer all kinds of different groups for women in crisis or going through life changes etc.

I just got into another one Saturday for "Taking Steps on Moving On". I know it sounds lke overkill but I was in such a bad way I was willing to seek and receive help where ever possible. As far as payment, they base it on your income and if you can't afford it, you don't have to pay until you are able.

AlAnon and Open AA have helped as well. I had to treat my relationship (if you can call it that) with P#2 like an addiction. That's helped tremendously. I was as hooked on him as much as any junkie on their drug of choice.

I've come to realize I have been very "sick". Good news is I feel like I am making progress and I'm on the road to recovery. I know for myself I will have to work on "me", "my stuff" for the rest of my life. I'll never "graduate" if you know what I mean.

This forum has been my sanctuary. It truly was my saving grace from God. I never knew what I had been dealing with and it provided a jumping off place for me to begin to learn and seek answers. As I read the posts I saw to many similarities to ignore.

I owe so much to so many. My forum friends (some who no longer post) were "there for me" in the beginning. I came on here hysterical and they (Kris especially) patiently drew me out and kept responding to my posts (thank you forever Kris if you still read here). Then Betrayed also started encouraging and validating my experience. I was beginning to think I was the crazy one. My therapist (God Bless her forever as well) told me after I told her my story what happened, that I had great instincts. . .if I had not has this validation from here (the forum) plus hers, I don't know where I would be today. No exageration.

Stay with it Treefrog. You are worth the investment of your own time and energy to learn as much as you can as fast as you can. There are wonderful success stories here.

You and us (fellow forumer's) can be one of them!! :-)

One more thing Treefrog, help and support is out there, it just takes a little effort to find it. Keep seeking. I wish you well.
finished

Wow, finished, your not finished, the light at the end of the tunnel, the rainbow, thank you, tis Sunday, tuck the kids into bed and will read your post again tomorrow.

Well, I had to read this from you finished at least a half a dozen times at least, thank you for sharing. I think we all have to take the time and asess our lives. I know from being married for 30 years that abuse comes in many forms. And now coming to grips with daughter and her illness and why it got so damn bad, I have thought back, trying to put the pieces somehow together, everything is reletive, I suppose.
Miss was my first born and only girl in four more boys to come. She is petite, well built, long blonde hair, big blue eyes, she can get along and enhance everyone she meets, always did. She was spoiled, being the only girl in a large male dominated family, she could twink an eye. sit on Grandpa's lap and get whatever she asked for. From 10 years to 13 she was invited to spend the summers in Florida with Grandma and StepGrandpa ( another story, but related ). She began to steal things and in the sunner of her 14th year at a visit form Grandma and Step she said that Step had fondled her after bedtime and she was upset. And yaknow I made her sit down and tell me everything that happened over and over until I was convinced that action had to be taken. I approached my mate and told him that I thought we had a concern. He went to talk to him with his brother and he denied but told me over the telephone that it was the drink that made him do it, he confessed. Children's Aid was involved as Miss was depressed going back to school in her 9th grade, he was put on a list and we haven't spoken to their family, husbands mother ever since. I hope I am not getting to long here but that was the first tool the Miss had, I was to blame and some how whatever happened in her life was all my fault ever since. She left at 16, she can raise sympathy, by George with everyone, twisting the truth, telling lies, at 16 she was gone and for the past 10 years has had over a dozen relationships, guys got her apartments, outfitted them, she has been in trouble with the law, boy...she can make herself look like a real nice catch, but that's all for now
thanks to all

Treefrog

>>I was to blame and some how whatever happened in her life was all my fault ever since.<<

Oh Treefrog, what a burden to be blamed for what happened. . .I know the guilt I carried for years because I stayed with P#1 and he was an alcholic that exhibited all the P behaviors especially when drinking. When my two youngest started acting out drinking, drugging and all the stuff that goes along with that (lying, stealing P behavior) I blamed myself for that. Going to Alanon has helped me learn I didn't cause it, I can't control it, and I can't cure it. It has taken alot of hard work on my part to quit enabling because of my guilt they were able to quite cleverly manipulate me. Do I detect that you feel some of that also?

Keep posting Treefrog. It really helps. Especially when we realize we are not alone in our pain.

Take care of yourself Treefrog. I'm so glad you are here with us.
finished

Treefrog,

It must difficult for you. I have kids as well I can just imagine what that is. But what is so great is that you are researching the matter in-depth. there are not so many parents are doing so, whether you will find a solution or not, you will do the best. I am sure that you will somehow appease the pain, the suffering. Believe me that is great what you are doing. Go on. We, as mother, don
t always have the knowledge to do something about it, but if we catch up, we can do some very good things to heal the conflicts. I sometimes wish I could go back in time but the only thing I can really do is get educated for the next conflicts. Hang in there.

Thought I would share these words
"Believe that you are defeated, believe it long enough, and it is likely to become a fact."
Norman Vincent Peale

My stepson has been diagnosed as a psychopath (among many other diagnoses). I met my husband when his son was fifteen (this was eight years ago), so it hasn't been as hard on me as it has been on him--I was never able to develop a deep emotional bond with this kid, something I've felt terribly guilty about.

My husband says he was a normal baby and toddler until he was almost two years old. My husband had split with his son's mother and retained custody (she wasn't too tightly wrapped from all accounts). My husband wanted his son to have a relationship with his mother and when Stepson was almost two, allowed his mother to take him for what was supposed to be a weekend visit.

Unknown to my husband, his ex had already re-married (their divorce wasn't even final at that point!). The man she had married was physically violent. They didn't bring the baby back when the weekend was over and it took my husband two weeks to find him. He was finally contacted by the hospital where his son had been taken when he stopped breathing after "falling off a table."

The truth was that he'd been severely abused in the week and a half he was with his mother and her husband. He sustained severe head trauma--they called 911 when they discovered he wasn't breathing. He also had burns all over his body and several other fractures.

The man was charged with felony child abuse and convicted. His mother was charged with neglect and convicted.

Stepson spent 6 months in foster care, while the state decided if my husband was a fit parent. The final decree gave my husband sole custody and the mother supervised visitation only. She visited several times, then made an attempt to kidnap him and disappeared. No one, not even her own family, knows whether she is alive or dead.

My husband says that when he first visited his son in the hospital and then in foster care, it was as if he was visiting a different toddler, not his own son. The physical features were all the same but the personality had totally changed. Before the abuse, he'd been a sunny, easy going baby and toddler; after the abuse he was withdrawn and deeply angry. And he wanted to hurt people.

When Stepson was four years old, he started putting pins in my husband's bed. Not just laying them in there, he would actually lift up the bottom sheet and poke them through at an angle. Or open the pillow and place pins so that they were concealed until the pillow was pressed upon.

By the time Stepson was six years old, my husband had learned never to leave his food unwatched. If he left his plate for even a couple seconds, Stepson would stir something into it. Started out with salt or pepper or sugar (things that were on the table) and quickly progressed to household cleaners, medications, etc.

Stepson started shoplifting at five years old. My husband had no idea he was doing it until they were stopped by a store security guard one day.

By the time Stepson was going to middle school (7th grade) he was a chronic truant. At one point, the school had my husband walking him to his first class of the day. Stepson would wait until my husband walked off down the hall, then he'd walk out of the room, leave school grounds, often beat my husband back to the apartment, take what he wanted and be gone for the day.

The school wanted my husband to stay at the school all day and escort his son from class to class but that just wasn't realistic for a single parent with a job.

Stepson was in therapy from the time he landed in the hospital at just under two years old until he was sixteen years old. Didn't do one bit of good and in fact, may have done some harm--he learned how to give therapists what they wanted to hear. From those fourteen years in therapy, he was given a variety of diagnoses. Psychopath is the one that fits best.

At sixteen, he'd already been in trouble with the law for shoplifting, burglary, breaking and entering, drugs, etc. Unfortunately, he was a very appealing, charming kid and managed to charm police officers out of charging him or into reducing charges several times. We got so frustrated with the police! That changed after the time Stepson was drunk and was caught by a police officer who was sitting in a marked police car watching him try to break into a pickup. It started off as the normal sort of arrest where Stepson charmed his way out of it, but something happened at the police station to trigger him. It took six police officers finally to restrain one single kid who weighed 105 pounds (he's five foot two inches). After that incident, the police weren't charmed by him anymore and they were much more sympathetic to what we were going through.

At sixteen, he was finally charged and confined to a juvenile facility (for which we had to pay). Stepson swore he would never forgive us for not being willing to go to court and assure the judge that we were able to supervise him. He was held until he was 18 years old, then released.

In the years since then, we know he's fathered at least three children who are within three weeks of age (one set of twins, one single) plus at least one infant who is about a year younger with yet a third girl (who was fourteen when she conceived). Both mothers have lost custody of the children. Stepson has been convicted of statutory rape in the case of the fourteen year old.

It makes me sick at heart to realize that he appears to be fixated on teens.

When I first met my husband, I thought all the kid needed was a firm and consistant adult presence. After trying to deal with him for six months, I fully understood why my husband was basically at his wits' end trying to deal with this kid.

The saddest thing for me is that the kid is not without charm. Every now and then he calls or sends a card and he appears sweet, loving, charming, funny. It's so hard to remember that it's a facade, it's not reality.

It's hard for my husband to know that his son is unhappy and not be able to fix it. In fact, doing anything for Stepson seems to make him worse, so we now have a "no more chances" family rule in regards to him. No more money, no more support, absolutely no help with jobs or anything like that.

Stepson is pretty much out of our day-to-day life because he chose to move over 1000 miles away. We usually only hear from him when he's in jail. In a sick way, it's a relief to know he's in jail because it's a low risk environment and he's likely to survive it plus it means he's not out victimizing more people.

As I said way back in the beginning, I was never able to develop a deep emotional bond with this kid. I felt terribly guilty about it for years and sometimes I still do. I have come to realize that there's two reasons for this. One, I learned very quickly that I could never trust this kid. Two, I think he assessed me pretty quickly and decided that there was nothing in it for him--I wasn't a prospective sexual partner, I demonstrated right away I would not go behind his father's back and I made it clear that I didn't trust him. There was no reason for him to try to con me and this kid is a pragmatist--if he can't succeed with one person, he just looks for the next target.

Maybe this is too long, I don't know. I try not to brood on it but am not always successful.

I did learn alot about psychopaths and how to survive them and I'm hoping my experience will do someone else some good.

Eithne

Eithne,
Welcome to the forum, that is such a terrible story.Poor child who has suffered an irreversible trauma. All those years of sufferings for the father. I am sure you will be able to help the one that have kids as a sociopath.

Eithne, welcome to the forum. Please do not hesitate to post as much as you would like. You tell a very sad story. It must be very painful to have a child who is a Psychopath.

Di

Thank you for the welcome.

You know, Stepson isn't happy. I don't think psychopaths can be happy. Contented, sometimes, maybe--but from watching Stepson for eight years, I don't think I've ever seen him truly happy. Or truly anything, sad, homesick, in love, any other emotion--except anger.

Everyone loses.

Thank you for the welcome. A forum like this is a great idea.

It's hard on my husband and, indirectly, on me because I worry what will happen to my husband if anything happens to Stepson.

Eithne

Thank you for sharing your story. How very tragic for your family, especially your husband and his son. Welcome to the forum, I am so glad you are here. . .

finished

Thank you for your welcome!

I'm hoping that I can contribute some of the things I learned from the experience--otherwise it will feel like even more of a waste than it is.

I have a son who is 36 and recently out of prison. I helped him get into an apt. and secure insurance for his car. I helped with minimal furniture. Once he got everything he needed he now does not talk to me. He has done this several other times in the past. It still hurts very much. Today he stood up his almost 4 yr. old daughter. I just am sick inside.

SJS,

Welcome to the forum. I am sorry that your son is such a source of disappointment. If you feel comfortable doing
so, please tell us more about his personality, his habits,
etc....

Rick

My son is 36 yr. old and has been using, dealing, and making drugs for many years. In between times he is incarcerated and has been since age 18. He has done atleast 10 + years all together if you add them all up. He has two small children from different women. He does not see his children or seem to care about them. He is always thinking about himself and his needs. He writes to me when he is locked up and always sounds so good in his letters. He talks about how things will be different. Then he gets out and just goes right back to the same old way of life. He just got finished getting me to co-sign for an apartment. I really believed he was trying. It was all an act that I fell for. My question to you parents do you just have to cut off all relationships with these type of people? He is my only child. He has been uncaring all his life. He did not attend his Grandmother's funeral. I believe he loves me but he only says it never shows it.The other pattern is the constant lying. It is so difficult to know if he ever tells the truth. I am really in a place I don't know what to do. Please give me any suggestions you might have.

sjs

Hi sjs, welcome to the forum. Your situation sounds very sad. Have you had a chance to read Dr. Hare's book?

From what I understand 30% of the prison population are Psychopaths.

Does you son appear to have a concience. What about his eyes, do they look normal or without emotion. You must be thinking he is a Psychopath since you ended up here.

We can help and support you as needed.

Di

sjs,
Welcome to the forum. I found so much support here. You have truly found a place to come where people understand what your going through.
betterway

I received this by error via emal. sjs is looking for feedback and comments

To: dianne@psychopath-research.com
Sent: Tuesday, September 09, 2003 12:49 AM
Subject: Re: Reply to your post

Hi Diane,
I am in the process of reading Dr. Hare's book. I find it difficult because the more I read the more I see of my son. The only thing that confuses me is my son is not violent. He does not do physical harm to people. All his criminal history is drug related.

I have not really ever noticed his eyes. I do notice he has difficulty making eye contact or hearing what anyone else is saying. He is so self centered. He has been this way since he was a toddler.

What do parent do? Can I have any relationship at all or do I have to refrain from any contact? I am in a very difficult time trying to absorb this information. I want to talk to my own psychiatrist about it as well. I suffer from depression and anxiety.

Thanks for your note,
sjs

Hi,
I have been reading Dr. Hare's book "Without Conscience." It is a great book filled with information but two things are bothering me. I can not see in my P any form of physical harm to people or animals. I know he has caused tremendous emotional pain to his children and friends and family but never violence. All of his crimes are drug related and never violent. Does this rule him out as a P or am I in denial? I really would like to hear if anyone out there has a P that falls into this situation or has heard of one. Please share your thoughts.
sjs

The P I knew did not do physical harm. His torture was emotional and psychological. I can't diagnose your son but if you are in emotional pain then you deserve to find help for yourself no matter what he is. Keep coming back here, reading and sharing. You will find the answers along the way. betterway

SJS,

It is well documented and this also happens to be the case with the P in my life. He was not physically violent to people or animals.....unless provoked. In fact he seemed to enjoy (?) the company of animals....but showed absolutely no emotion when his dog was stolen....and again no emotion when the dog was found several days later.
So, to answer your question, this does not rule your P out as a P. There are many "white collar" P's out there.
Rick

Whether or not you decide to continue contact, you should give a great deal of thought about continuing to help the person financially, specially if it's a hardship for you.

I am quite sure you are a good parent, and that his condition is not a product of upbringing. Severe disorders I truly believe are genetic. Just think about it, what could you possibly have done to make him unfeeling?

Algaringo

Hi All, Being new and totally relieved to know that there are other parents with similar problems to mine. My step daughter was diagnosed as being psychopathic at the age of 6 years which is extremely young for such a diagnosis. At first we thought it was all just a normal reaction to the changes in her life. New step mom, sister and brother, but we soon realised that it went much further than that. Besides the constant lying, stealing and agressiveness, both physically (towards the other children especially) and verbally, the most difficult aspect was the rejection and critisism we got from our family and friends. When amoungst strangers or "outsiders" she turns into the most well behaved, well mannered child any parent could wish to have. No one wanted to beleive anything we told them.
It is now 9 years further on and she is 15 and very quickly becoming worse. She seems to have one goal in mind and that is to break up the family we have tried to create. (and she is succeeding)
How are we supposed to continue? Any advice?

Hi Jenny

I'm glad you've found the forum and I hope you find it helpful. I think being the parent of a psychopath must be the very worst of all situations. Although my situation was different - my ex was a P - I think there are a few things that apply to all situations. They seem to know just what buttons to press to bring out the worst possible behaviour in all those around them, and somehow come out smelling of roses themselves - as you say, outsiders can't believe the things you tell them about her because she is so nice when they are around. The only advice I can give is to keep your belief in yourself and in the other members of your family. Watch out for the 'divide and rule' tactic where the P sets one person against another by provoking bad behaviour on the part of those around them. Keep your belief in yourself and in your husband and the other children - you are not a bad parent, and what is happening is NOT your fault.

I've heard that Dr Hare is experimenting with a treatment plan which, although it will not cure the P, will, they hope, give them goals that will to some extent modify their behaviour. I wonder if its worth finding out about this?

All the very best and I'm sorry I can't be of more help.

Ali,

Very well put. Bravo!

Rick