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#651 - 12/06/06 09:21 PM Re: The Mask of a Psychopath [Re: kludgette]
denfox Offline
member

Registered: 11/27/06
Posts: 82
I have a couple of thoughts:

I've seen that vacuous stare.

Also, the psychopath, while an intuitive observer of others (they need to be, in order to manipulate), they sometimes seem totally oblivious of their own signals. They may have inappropriate gestures in social situations, or they may be speaking to one person, but maintaining eye contact with another. My psychopath boss tends to stare at me when speaking to others.

I think that cruelty to animals may be more predominate in the male psychopath than the female psychopath - though, I'm not certain.

A possible explanation for the apparent display of empathy (tears) at the movie, may be that the psychopath identifies with the character in the movie and the tears are for themself more than the movie character.

Fear - and this is an unsubstantiated theory on my part - fear, may enrage the psychopath because inside the psychopath is a great deal of fear and insecurity. They probably learned at a very young age that agression means winning and they use it unabashedly.

Money represents control a main objective of the psychopath. Again, here is another unsubtantiated theory on my part: the psychopath probably has the least control of themselves, a complete inability to control themselves, then spurs them to seek to control others, whom they blame for their own problems. Seeing themselves as less than masters of their own destiny, and always seeing blame in others causes them to attempt to control those around them in an effort to achieve an inner peace that is totally lacking in themselves. If they can control those whom they blame for their own inadequacies, then all would be perfect in their world.

Just some ideas I have. I'd be interested in how others think about my ideas. Perhaps, your experiences or your studies can help feel in the gaps as I am still learning.

-denfox
Ancaro imparo [I am still learning] - Michelangelo

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#14243 - 02/01/13 09:10 AM Re: The Mask of a Psychopath [Re: Anonymous]
1962 Offline
member

Registered: 01/31/13
Posts: 206
I can't believe I found this web site. I am currently out of my home because I found out my husband of 30 years had put drugs in my food/drink. He became unmasked to me when I was given a dose of arsenic and became ill. He led me to the couch and began rubbing my feet and face and saying in an odd voice, " I'm not going anywhere".
He acted as if he was in a dream state. Since that night I have seem many sides of him that were hidden to me.

I don't remember much more about that night ( I did not know at the time it was arsenic)I do know that the symptoms mimicked over active thyroid disease which is what I attributed it to. If he had insisted on taking me to the hospital I would not have suspected that something was terribly wrong.

I know know that he has been seeing/using a nurse for some time and am sure now that I am out of the house and healthy that I have been dosed with who knows what. My GP tested me for everything and found the arsenic at higher than normal levels in my urine. I have been to every doctor imaginable and found that my intestinal track, from my throat to my anus was highly inflammed.

I also found a white powder in his medicine case that I now believe is coumidin. I sent a sample to a lab, but all they could say was that it was a compound. I had thought that it was meth or coke due to his increasingly odd behavior.

I feel that there might be someone he is obcessed with who triggers his actions. He receives regular restricted calls from who I believe is a man. Is this man blackmailing him? Before I was poisoned, I confronted my husband about being gay/infidelity. He acts as if I am crazy and has stated as much- when I returned to the area after running away, I confronted him (after contacting the state police and telling my family). He threw himself on the floor and screamed over and over that he didn't do it, that he would kill who ever harmed me...Blah blah blah.

That reminded me of when we were in a local store and a stranger got nastly with me over moving a cart- his reaction to that man was extreme and was a red flag to me that something was wrong. Over the next few weeks, I realized that the nicer he was to me, the sicker I became.

My husband is quite high profile in our community and in his job. I now believe that I have been a beard for him all these years. It was my staying home and raising 2 kids, and putting off my own career that allowed him to become prominent in his field and gain power and wealth. I'm not talling huge amounts of money, but probably over half million. That is what I thought was the motivator money- but now I am seeing that there is so much more to this. What I once thought was a simple affair with his secretary has turned into a nightmare.

People think that I am crazy to leave this man who outwardly appeared to adore me. I hired 2 PIs who revealed a little more to me, but now that I know he is a psychopath, I see that he is a master at hiding his actions. The lies and web of people that he uses for his own benefit is amazing. Everyone loves him. He is still contacting me wanting to work out our issues. Even after I confronted him. Did I mention that we did everything together and we were best friends? I don't know how he had the time and energy for this lifestyle. He has "hinted" that when he was away at conferences the indiscretions occurred. I hate the little hints about what he has done; is it because he wants to get caught or is it that he thinks I am too dumb to figure out his secrets?

I had filed for divorce and am interviewing a few attorneys now that I have more knowledge about his mental illness. ( I will probably be in for a real fight)


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#14246 - 02/01/13 11:44 PM Re: The Mask of a Psychopath [Re: 1962]
trudy Offline
member

Registered: 04/28/12
Posts: 24
Hello 1962,

I wanted to make a quick note regarding attorneys. I know of people who have had to fight a hard divorce battle and this was one of the suggested tactics. It does depend on how much you can spend.

What was recommended is that one arrange consultations with several of the best lawyers in your area. Particularly ones you think he would like to hire. You are not obligated to tell the attorneys about each other but in consulting them, offering your story and paying them for their time they are prevented from representing your husband. I know this sounds extreme but it does put a wrench in his ability to hire the best.

Of course you should do what you are most comfortable with. I just know that a psychopath with any means is a major source of trouble when you are trying to get them to do something they do not want to do.

I am so sorry for all of the horrible stuff you are having to go through. I wish you strength, health and victory.

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#14247 - 02/02/13 12:10 PM Re: The Mask of a Psychopath [Re: trudy]
1962 Offline
member

Registered: 01/31/13
Posts: 206
Thanks for the advice Trudy. That is an interesting angle- I have learned that I can't begin to know what he is up to. What I do know is that he is probably gay and wants to continue to be "married". I am pretty sure he has been with both men and women at this point. He is 56 and I would be curious to know if he will mellow as he gets older. I do see having to deal with him quite a bit as we have children, relatives, finances, ect together. Does anyone know if they "improve" with age?

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#14248 - 02/02/13 01:13 PM Re: The Mask of a Psychopath [Re: 1962]
Dianne E. Offline

Administrator
member

Registered: 11/15/02
Posts: 2788
Loc: United States
Hi, great advice Tudy!!

Hi 1962

Quote:
Does anyone know if they "improve" with age?


From what members have posted over the years, my personal conclusion is that they do improve, not in the way I think you are asking. They seem to improve their skills and are more evil.

That is just my opinion.

Di

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#14249 - 02/02/13 06:28 PM Re: The Mask of a Psychopath [Re: Dianne E.]
1962 Offline
member

Registered: 01/31/13
Posts: 206
Diane, that's disconcerting to hear, especially since we wil soon be grandparents. I was hoping that this mental illness would diminish with age and ability. He is 56 but has diabeties and does not take good care of himself.(maybe that's another reason why he's seeing the nurse!) He claims to be seeing a psychologist since I filed for divorce, but of course I suspect that it is for show in the event we go to court.

I am seeing a counselor next week who specializes in clinical psychopathy. I hope that he will be able to give me greater insight into what I have to deal with.

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#14250 - 02/03/13 02:11 AM Re: The Mask of a Psychopath [Re: 1962]
trudy Offline
member

Registered: 04/28/12
Posts: 24
Hello again 1962,

I wish I could tell you that the problems diminish and psychopathy abates as they age but as far as I can tell this is not the case. My ex Psychopath is now 68, sadly his age just affords that many more years to have honed and adapted his deception and manipulation skills. He has the hot headed aggression of a man half his age, very high intellectual abilities and the emotional capacity of a toddler.

I have read in several places that their narcissism increases with age. From my experience I believe this is true.

I cannot tell you what to do but if I was in your position I would think like a lawyer and a detective, gather EVERYTHING possible. I would take or photocopy all phone records, credit card records, view, take images or copy any incriminating texts, computer downloads, uploads etc...

I wish I had known not to even mention personality disorder, mental illness or anything to him until my ducks were in a row. I wish I had played dumb just long enough to give myself the time to collect data and prove what he was up to. I wish I had recorded conversations, some of which were so insane even I couldn't believe them. I wish I had been more careful with my confidences, many people just cannot understand and will not believe it. This can undermine your efforts at getting what you need and also, getting through this time.

Be well

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#14251 - 02/04/13 06:03 AM Re: The Mask of a Psychopath [Re: trudy]
1962 Offline
member

Registered: 01/31/13
Posts: 206
Thank you Trudy. I actually made a statement to the state police (unknown to him). I have a victim's advocate who helped me do this. I have also told several family members (who hid me from him for months as I didn't know who was helping him poison me- again I think that he has several people he strings along).

I also hired a PI who found a few things (this my husband knows about). I have phone records also. Since I did all of the household billing, I have no questions about that aspect.

right now he knows he is being monitored and is like a choirboy. I have confronted him about his affairs and his not being at work when he was supposed to be.

Now when I have contact with him, he isn't sure how to act as I am not falling for his old lines. He goes between "normal" to little boy cutsey and then angry/moody. I too have been taping our conversations, but he is more guarded now. We did have some real interesting ones right before he poisoned me though, he said when I died he was going to put my ashes in a dildo (hence my suspicions that he may be gay- along with his gawking at men while on vacation).

I'm wondering if I am still in danger if I agree to just a legal separation instead of a full fledged divorce as this would allow me to keep my health insurance. He seems to really need the "married" title as has offered me more assets if I go this route- my other concern is that he could kill me and then get those assets if we were techinically married. I am researching having all assets put into a trust in which he would get nothing in that event.

A year ago I would have never believed that I would go through all of this, we spent 30 years happy and best friends.

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#14253 - 02/06/13 03:00 AM Re: The Mask of a Psychopath [Re: 1962]
trudy Offline
member

Registered: 04/28/12
Posts: 24

Hi 1962,

You sound so steady and resilient, I am amazed by your composure. It is horrible to think of what might have been. Thankfully you were able to get help in time. When I read that he was rubbing your feet and had that odd look/demeanor it made me wonder if you had ever noticed this look or way about him before? You were married for so long, has hindsight allowed you to put more pieces together?


Part of why I ask is that my ex Psychopath is a widower, he was married for 36 yrs.(or so). We talked openly about his wife,on one occasion he twice very casually tossed out the subject of Munchausen by proxy. He looked so odd when he said this (Psychopath weirdness) but I was naive then and read nothing into his comments. He was checking to see if I knew what it was, and he talked a little about it. When I look back I recall that strangeness in his face and the way he was speaking about it. He did not cause her illness but he found enjoyment in the novelty and extreme drama which he created surrounding her cancer.

He basked in the attention showered on him as he was heralded the adoring,heroic, wonderful, loving husband. He had total control over her while she was so ill. He was cheating on her during this time with a very unfortunate looking, married, older woman (who cleaned their teeth!!)what filth!

I wonder if your husband has a touch Munchausen by proxy going on as well? I am amazed that he talked people into assisting him with any part of his plan. Has he taken out any life insurance policies on you recently or made changes to any existing policies?

What I think of when it comes to motivation to poison you (aside from munchausen, longshot) is possibly the desire for ending the marriage without losing standing in the community or money. My ex Psychopath referred to his wife as a very effective business/social tool (said during dinner one eve., again, my ignorance allowed me to twist this into something sounding more sane) He had an ENORMOUS funeral and memorial for her. He told me once that he had "Given her a BIG SEND OFF" and wanted to leave it that way for a while! What I am getting at is this: He calculated that she is almost as useful to him now as she was when she was alive.

He pretends to grieve, gets the desired attention and permanently aligns himself with his effective business/social tool. He "sees" kind of desperate women on the sly and gets to maintain his high profile, good standing in the community. I keep quiet about this because his public persona and his "good name" are of supreme importance to him. I prefer to remain with the living.

Good idea to think of the trust or some arrangement that protects you. I would not trust this person, ever. Is he buying time? I told my ex that I kept a journal about everything and that my primary attorney has a copy.

Your situation is frightening, I cannot even believe he said he wanted to make your ashes into a dildo!!! That required some forethought, certainly not a spontaneous idea. What did he propose to do with said dildo? You might be on to something with the gay theory, ogling men is not a habit that straight men engage in.

I have a sense of what you are talking about when you mention being married for 30 yrs. I knew my ex Psychopath for 23 yrs, and never once in that time was there a hint that he was a Psychopath. In fact until everything came down there was no person alive who had been better to me in my life. He was the person I respected above all others, everything one could ask for in a friend, we never once had a cross word and he was never improper. Only in our relationship did I start to wonder what was going on, though I assigned that to grief.

When I witnessed my ex Psychopath lose his mask I was in shock and the entire world seemed to lose meaning. The foundation of my life sort of crumbled and I was in suspended disbelief. It took a very long time for my mind to accept the truth and for me to rebuild. My prayer is that you may be spared the falling apart,that you will be whole and healthy and stronger than ever.

I know you are busy so please do not feel the need to reply because I wrote to you, just know that you are in my prayers.

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#14257 - 02/07/13 09:08 AM Re: The Mask of a Psychopath [Re: trudy]
1962 Offline
member

Registered: 01/31/13
Posts: 206


Thank you for your words- I am steady and composed right now because I have to be- when I think too much about it I start to have anxiety attacks.

I believe the first time I experienced his unmasking was probably a few weeks before the poisoning when he tried to get me to refinance our house- he wanted to take an additional 10,000 out (enough for a hitman?) He came home depressed (yet I could see he was “acting” ) saying that he thought he might lose his job. Of course I thought it might be possible because I had seen his behavior slowly erode the more I pressured him about his infidelity. Fortunately, I had begun closing out accounts and put money in a separate savings for my escape- every woman should have her own money.

The Munchausen by proxy has been mentioned to me by my sister who is a psychologist- I seemed to get sicker just when I began going to college- had bladder cancer (arsenic induced?), then some type of neurological problem drs thought it was autoimmune now think it could also have been arsenic. Have the same symptoms now, even worse. But now that they know to look for arsenic , drs no longer believe it was/ is autoimmune.

I think the whole rubbing of the feet is because he was/is involved with a nurse ( I think her name is Dawn / he slipped and called me D… one day) I think that she may be involved and may have taken an insurance policy out on me. I worked quite far from home at one point so it was possible that she could have come to the house and met with an insurance agent. Apparently divorcing is the only way to end him as a beneficiary.

I think originally he may have poisoned me to keep me dependent on him (he is still trying to manipulate me by offering more money if I just get legally separated rather than divorced- the title married seems very important to him)

I also recall the strangeness in his face and his movements, he seemed very quiet and moved almost weightlessly. (he is 6’2” and 250 pounds)
He has several masks (persona) that I have seen since then, he seems to be struggling with how to approach me.

I think you are spot on about trying to kill me without losing his married title and without losing his standing AND money. My Psychopath also has said that he underestimated my ability to take care of the finances. I was also the intelligent woman who he took to state functions.
He told everyone he was going to have a huge party for my 50th birthday, which just about coincided with my poisoning (how ironic- a funeral)

My husband also pretended to be devastated and told all he could that he had no clue as to why I would leave him. He began telling people that I went crazy and/or left to live with a younger man I met though work.

Right now I am working with a clinical psychologist who specializes in psychopaths- he told me after the first hour that my husband will try to kill me again. Yes, I think he is buying time to come up with a new plan. I have told my husband that I have a Private Investigator and he will never know when he is being followed.

Did your psychopath drop little hints all the time? Mine has done more and more of it- letting me know that what I believe is dead on; I am not gay, you don’t think I had an affair with my secretary?, I stopped at the gas station for coffee every day (where I believe the person he was arranging to have me hurt lives across from) the list goes on and on.

Trudy, I do feel a little better knowing that you too did not know your husband was a psychopath. What was it exactly that made you realize it?

I too felt disbelief when my husband became unmasked. Right now I am the one living out of the family home, living on unemployment and watching my every move. The counselor I met with told me not to trust him for one second, but I also have two children who interact with him daily – they know that their father has tried to poison me- but they do not know that he is psychopath. Did you have children with your psychopath?

“When I witnessed my ex Psychopath lose his mask I was in shock and the entire world seemed to lose meaning. The foundation of my life sort of crumbled and I was in suspended disbelief.”

Yes, that applies to me also- I’m not sure that I have actually accepted it and embraced the truth even yet. I see the benefit of no contact as he can surely suck me in- I still want to believe that none of this is true- I have to remind myself daily. A horrible way to live.

Your words and reflections give me strength, I appreciate your sharing with me what you experienced- it really helps and is part of my daily reminder. Going online and reading/rereading what people have gone through helps me understand what I have survived so far.

Thank you for your prayers.

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