Of his 2 children.....

That's the problem I have to deal with now......
I will tell more so mayby it's better to understand.

He met his girlfriend in jail. They where both very young and homeless.
They desided they want a baby so they get a house from the government OR I would take them in..they thought!!!
She didn't get pregnant that time....
6 years ago..my son was 19 at the time,they had my oldest grandson.
The baby got everything;..so many toys they had to pile them up...but no healthy food....Nike shoes....But no love....
My son didn't pay rent so they had to move out.
When he was in jail agian. my ex daughter in law ( I will call her fay) paid the bills..If he'd come home from jail he foned the bank to get the money back..So that got worse all the time...
In the presents of the baby he would use harddrugs. The little boy didn't have his own room because my son used it to grow hasjies.
Within a few months she was pregnant again...This baby was born when he was in jail.Now there were two boys sleeping in the same room where the father and mother sleep......
The other grandmother and me, went to their doctor to warn him of the childabuse , but we weren't taken serieous.
Finally Fay get smart and fled.
She is now married and has a 3th son.
She didn't allow me for three years to have contact....Till a month or two ago.
she appologised to me... And we spoke about a lot of thinkgs that had happend.
She wanted me to see the grandchildren again.I was very reluctend because I was afraid that it was for the time beiing again.And I would get hurt again.
But ...these are my grandchildren!!!

Now the latest news is that my son wants to be the guardian of his sons.....
Ofcourse we are afraid that he will succeed.
The people I talked with about this,don't know about ps.so they all say..he won't get the children..the system simply won't allow him!
I know, and hope people here know, that's far from reality.

I don't know what to do...
Don't know if I can do anything about it
I have the feeling that if he succeeds and the children have to live with him, they will last for 1 or 2 weeks and than he will kill them or get them killed in an accident.
he had 6 cars in the last 5 or 6 months, he is in accidents all the time.

Problem is that Fay asked me to help her....
believe me...I never had sleeping problems..but now I do...

If I help her, I will betray my son, my child...
I know he is a ps....But I am not
I do have feelings..There are two things..One is my child... The other is that he is what and who he is...Sounds strange I know...Though it is one person...for me it feels like two persons....

If I don't do anything I will make a fool of myself because not doing anything is also doing... Do I make sense to you ????
Not taking action is also an action......

If I help him...I will be an accomplice in anything that will happen to the two boys.....

The oldest grandson has just turned 5 years old..the youngest will be 4 in January
Please tell me your points of view in this problem.......

Hello Segaya,

Shortly, my conclusion from your post is: I would worry about the 2 boys, they could be innocent normal children.

Take it this way: your son is the bad guy, regardless of the fact that he's your son.

And: there are 2 kids! Not 1, but 2!!!

Even if you feel you love your son and the 2 kids, its a...

2-1 situation, like in football...

Better save 2 innocent kids from 1 father whom you know has problems...

Sometimes I feel similarly with my father.
He's my father.
I am loyal, he is not loyal to me.
He too makes "accidents", but not with cars, other things...
All his animals die or "disappear"

So, if I had kids, I wouldn't care about my father, would just make sure he cannot hurt them!

Of course, if you decide to help your grandchildren, then your son must not find out.
I think he could take revenge.

Hmm, I don't know, I would like to help you so much, I think I start to understand your situation...

But, if you "SAVE" your grandkids, what would that mean?
-> do they have a normal mother?
-> you are alone, I think, also with health problems, so you cannot take care of them, I think... it's too hard and they would suffer too
-> they need a good, normal family, where could they go?
-> maybe even a stepfather could be better if he could love and accept them...?

Any way you have to make sure that your son cannot hurt you or the kids.

Of course, if the law could impose some kind of a "distance keeping" for your son... like if he is legally considered a danger to his own kids, it could be easier.

I do understand how painful and how complicated this is to you.

Hi Segaya

Your son should not be allowed anywhere near your grandchildren….what can he offer them? Love, morals, guidance, understanding, a future? If someone asked you the same question about their grandchildren I know you would say the same. Your son is not fit to be a parent, guardian or son. Has he ever done anything good for you or anyone else he has met?

I’m amazed at your strength and courage and I wonder whether you just need some of us to support what you really want to do about the children.

I would be very surprised if the authorities in Holland would allow him to get guardianship if ‘Fay’ is coping with her children. You should keep a diary of all the things he does so you can present it in court if he takes it that far. It could be weak threats to make you pay attention to him.

You would not betray your son…you would betray your grandchildren. Your son has a choice they do not.

Regards
Jan

Hello Jan.....read this please.....

http://www.custody911.com/custodyconsult3/_disc12/00001557.htm

need I say more.......
I will respond on a later time...I am busy now....

Can somebody please tell me where to find the checklist ?

Hi

Try this.

ttp://www.sociopathicstyle.com/traits/classic.htm

Jan

I think you are right Jan!!!
I guess The problem is in me.....If there's an objective view to this problem..there is no question about what to do.....
I am not objective in my feelings. My brain tells me to make the choice for the children ...ofcourse.... no doubt about.
But my emotions are taking over. I can't get to the point were I can say clear and out loud to the mother of the little ones...'you have to do this and that in order to overrule him, do so and so and you will see you will win this custody process.....'
If I would do so...I would have the feeling of betraying my child......My eyes see the ps....But my heart still knows the day he was born.
So it is paralyzing me....I don't do anything now....But I know by not taking action one takes action any how....
And this gives my a hughes problem...Because IF he succeeds, in my mind and heart I will be part of that, and everything that will follow ......

Dear Jan,
The site you gave me doesn't work..is it still online?

http://www.sociopathicstyle.com/traits/classic.htm

Try that. It was just missing an h at the beginning of the address.

Take it from me, do all you can to protect those grandbabies of yours. I know how hard it is to choose. I live in the middle of my heart all the time. If I had known what my son was capable of I would have taken my daughter and run as far away as possible.

I am still constantly torn because I know I am going to have to be the one to make sure my son stays in jail as long as possible and no mother wants to watch her child grow up in jail.

I always said if anyone ever hurt either one of my children that would be the only time I could ever kill someone. I just never expected that person to be my first born child. It puts me in an emotional bind 24 hours a day, seven days a week, year in year out.

If you truly believe your grandchildren will die because of your son's actions you have a moral obligation to help. For most people being a mother means protecting your child from harm. For mothers of psychotics being a mother is turned into protecting other people's children from your own if possible.

Hi Segaya

Apologies for not coming back to you sooner, I was ill over Christmas but feeling much better now. I checked the link and it's no longer there but I'm sure you will find what you are looking for here on the forum in the Resource section. If not let me know and I'll find some other links for you.

I don't think I answered your queation on how I built the wall around me-yes-I did visualise building a real brickwall, like a well but above ground and I could poke my head over the top if I wanted to see what was going on. It was only there for the P it didn't show to anyone else. Crazy I know but it was the best tool I found to deal with a sitaution I could not change. The kid was then totally out of his comfort zone as he didn't know how to deal with me, nothing he threw at me got through, he didn't know whether I even knew he had thrown something at me. He couldn't read me so I had control and as we all know there is nothing a P hates more than not being in control.

I do have to add that he did try even harder to get to me at first but hadn't the staying power to keep it up because he got no reaction. He then moved on to another victim, his own mother.

I do agree with what others have been saying here that you are only a victim if you let yourself be and give the P even the slightest reaction.

I'd love to hear other peoples' techniques for blocking out a P.

I think Clee gave you some very good advice about your little ones. I would have liked to have said it as she did but didn't want you to feel someone was telling you how to deal with your conscience. I feel Clee has the right to do so because of her understanding of how bad things can get.

Regards
Jan

I hope I did not sound too heavy-handed in my thoughts on your grandchildren Segaya.

After losing my baby and knowing how it has nearly destroyed me I would hate for anyone to have to go through the same thing if there was any way to prevent it.

C--

Hi

That was an excellent link you provided, the 3 articles also mentioned were very interesting especially #3.

Could you tell us a bit more about the Reform Movement?

Regards
jan

That was your link Jan. I just added an h to the beginning of it for Segaya b/c she had said she could not get on it. I only looked at it briefly to make sure it was what she was looking for before posting it up here.

I will tell you more about what I do over the weekend. It is Friday evening and I try to make myself get away from all this mess and go eat dinner with my "leftover" friends (they love that name) and listen to some music for a bit.

It is time to retreat into the "normal" world for a bit. I promise I will tell more as the weekend goes on.

Everybody go try to relax. God made weekends for a reason.....

C--