I have a friend who has recently lost her fiance to a unexpected brain hemorrhage. She has just started dating someone who we met two of weeks ago.

He was very aggressive with everyone (well, alternated aggressive/charming), talked unbelievable nonsense, and obviously thinks he's just fantastic. At one point when my friend, trying to make conversation, mentioned that one of the other girls there makes good tiramasu, he went off into a tirade about how she couldn't make tiramasu because it's not trifle (!!?) (he's never even met her before). This girl was eventually cowering in her seat but this guy seemed completely oblivious to her, and everyone ele's discomfort.

Needless to say, we all sat our friend down and few days later to try to get her to see the mistake she's making. In this conversation, she mentioned a few things about this guy that made my hair stand on end. Years ago my sister was involved with someone later diagnosed by a psychologist as a psychopath who left her a shell of her former self. Some of the things my fried described rang a clear bell:

For example, she told of how when he was left to man the office (he's a real estate agant) he just decided to go to the pub for the afternoon, telling his boss that he went to the bank. He got back four hours later. Later when his boss called to confront him a huge shouting match ensued. After the argument he was completely unable to see that he could be in the wrong. Apparently this happens often. My friend puts it down to his over inflated ego... !!!

He's always sponged a living off everyone else. He wanted my friend to take a bank loan out with him for millions to buy a restaurant - even though he has only ever been a waiter and an estate agent (and my friend was going to do it!) - and has never even owned his own car (he gets other people to drive him around everywhere).

When my friend told him that she was concerned and wasn't going to invest with him he immediately dropped the restaurant idea and said all the right things - so she's still with him.

I've made up an excel spreadsheet of the PCL-R and even when scoring him a 0 on factors that I don't know - like his childhood and past relationships, in my very informal score he still gets a score of 32/40.


I'm very concerned for my friend...

Hello Duncan

Your friend is very lucky to have you look out for her, it doesn't sound good and maybe with your support she will see things differently before she gets too sucked in. He seems to be fitting the description of a psychopath very well but unfortunately a diagnosis is rare unless the person concerned becomes involved in the judicial system and sometimes not even then.

It's so tricky as your friend will probably accuse you of not undertanding this man if you offer an opinion. Knowledge is power but unless she looks for it she will get trampled on.

I wish you well and if your friend needs any support or just needs to ask some questions there are plenty of members here who would be happy to help wherever they can. If she has her head in the sand and deliberately avoiding issues it will be extemely difficult to point her in the right direction. It may be better if you appear totally understanding of why she wants to be in this relationship then she is more likely to approach you when the concerns creep in.

I think I probably speak for a lot of members here when I say if most of us had a a friend like you we might have avoided a lot of pain and suffering as well as losing money.

Regards
Jan

Hi Duncan,
Welcome on the forum from me also.
Reading your story left me with a coplle of questions and I hope you don't mind me putting them down here hoping for an answer?

Is the time you write about accurate?
And if so... How do you know all these things so incredable fast????
It took most of us several years , so not decades to be able to point out what is wrong with somebody...Then searching for a place to get more knowledge about it..It is ammazing how clear this all is to you. Are you a therapist yourself for knowing so much and finding your way to this forum so quickly???
Regards Segaya

Hi Segaya

Yes, the times are right. My sister was involved for years with someone diagnosed as a psychopath, so I have some experience.

At first I thought this guy was just after her money (all of us did) and a pathological lier (an arsehole basically), but then when we spoke to her about him she mentioned some things that are just odd and I remembered from my sister's experience and what the psychologist told us to look for: His extreme ego, easy at lying, everything is everyone else's fault, bafflingly irresponsible, and can't ever see he's wrong, - even when he obviously is (not making excuses for his behaviour - really can't see it's wrong - see the boss story above)

These things triggered the warning bells and I went home a researched psychopathy, finding the PCL-R. The PCL-R is a perfect description of this guy. Then I've been spending the past week researching psychopaths, and almost everything I read applies to him. Finally I've found this forum.

With my sister it took some years to discover who he was because we didn't know the signs.
Knowing the signs makes a big difference.

So here's the update:

Everything is turning poisonous. This is like deja vous. Friends are turning on each other. It was just the same with my sister - the destructive power of these people is almost unbelievable. It destroyed our family before (my parents, brother and sister), and I'm not walking down this road again.

I've done what a friend can and pointed out the warning signs and we'll be there for her at the other end of this, when she'll need real friends, but she must make her own decision, I'm pulling out before everything I hold dear is poisoned.

Does anyone else see the similarity between Psychopath's and the ring in Lord of the Rings??? I'm no Frodo

hello Duncan

It's wise to step away from this situation, there is nothing you can do and the offer of being there when things fall apart is the best option.

I have never read Lord of the Rings....for 2 reasons, one of which is to to with psychopathy!

Regards
Jan

To jan...you are funny! To segaya...I dont think it takes long for a wise woman to realize she is only goin in circles. These people are crazy, but it doesnt have to take long to notice the same song has been on repeat for days! I knew nothing about "Psychopath's" but as I started looking at the obvious, I just thought... As much as I crave this obsessive attention, I know that it musnt last for forever. Sometimes when everything seems so dark and lonely, you have to know that you closed the door to your own house and locked it. No one can come in to help you because you wont let them. Get up off the floor and turn your own lights on...turn up your heater and open the front door to reality! Dont let shame trick you into staying longer...just because you took a litt;e break from reality doesnt mean you cant make a comeback! If we can push 8 lbs babies out of that small exit... and produce food from our own bodies, certainly we can manage to take out the trash as needed! I believe in all of you and I know in time these wounds will heal!

Hello Godsgrace

I have been thinking about your posts today and there are so many things you said that I would like to respond to but it will take me some time.

I would like to start by thanking you for sharing so much information and it was so uplifting to hear that you are doing well now. It is such a positive story that I would like to talk to you about so many things.

I know what you have told us will be so encouraging for parents who have children tangled up with suspected psychopaths.

You have added a whole new dimension to this forum and I'm sure many people reading here will feel a great sense of hope knowing what can be achieved.

If you don't want to discuss your situation any further I do undersatnd.

I think your expression 'body snatchers' is perfect.

Regards
Jan

Thank you Jan for the encouragement...I hope nobody is offeneded that I write what I do, but its so important to know that no matter what you can always walk away from danger.


I know that that although I am much younger than many of these victims, and I didnt stick around to suffer years of abuse from my Psychopath I still understand what its like to lose everything senses included. But I also know what its like to gain it back and its a wonderful experience.

I hope all of us can rebuild again. please keep writing to me, I love wisdom from the wise. You seem so compationate and its a great comfort. I still have some days where I am completely pissed off at my Psychopath and I would like to drive to Las Vegas and visit him in prison and slap the $*** out of him! I have things to over still and i know its a game of patience, but sometimes I dont quite feel like being patient. But with Gods help, it will get better ans top hurting so bad inside.

Hello Godsgrace

I’m sure no-one would be offended by what you have written. I think you have done a great job of analysing your situation and putting it in words. I could sense the anger and frustration you went through. I’m full of admiration that you saw so quickly what was really happening, you seem to be mature beyond your years. I know you will be an inspiration to our members.
You have proved that there is a way out of an abusive lifestyle despite the practical difficulties. It must be so comforting to have a strong faith to support you when other people can’t offer you that. We all need to have a believe in that gives us something solid to lean on.

I don’t think crying is at all silly, it has been proven that it is a method of stress relief and more men should do it. Wallowing in self pity seems to have the same benefit when it makes you decide to fight back.

The minister certainly followed the pattern, using your home and money despite being supposedly wealthy. The parasitic behaviour. Idolising you then bringing you down, buying you gifts to buy you. The conning, lying and cheating. Addiction to porn and sex, many relationships. Ending up in prison. The only thing I have no knowledge of is the excessive list making.

I understand your desire to slap him but just imagine yourself doing it to get it out of your system, I think if he knew he had got you to such a pitch it would please him because he would have control over you and this reaction. You know you can never allow him to have that knowledge or power. The worst thing for a man like him is to be ignored or treated as an inferior and as you have no contact …just keep on ignoring him. No contact whatsoever is the golden rule.

You have come out of this relationship a very wise woman and I’m so pleased that you have made a new and better life. I was wonderful to read your whole story as it’s not often we get the story and the positive outcome in such a short space of time.

I do hope you can offer us some insight into how you saw the light and how you found the strength to deal with this nightmare.

As I mentioned I loved the term ‘body snatcher’, that’s exactly what psychopaths do! Mentally and physically they try to take you over even to the extent of becoming the person whose body they have invaded. Sometimes it’s simple mirroring but more often assuming someone else’s identity.

Regards
Jan