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#9989 - 09/08/10 07:03 AM Re: Brother is anti social I need help [Re: Dianne E.]
twin Offline
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Registered: 09/05/10
Posts: 74
Dianne,

Thank you for your response. I've got a lot of ideas running through my head so forgive me if this post sounds disjointed.

A few of my siblings wondered if his cancer was a legitimate diagnosis as well. So my SIL took him to one of his appointments and it was confirmed. Initially, he was getting treatment at a "free" clinic about an hour away. This was terribly inconvenient for those who drove him and our concern was that he would be the only person with information. Thankfully, we persuaded him to get treatment at a local "free" clinic before the bed bug infestation. Had we not, I'm convinced none of us would have known and he would have infested our mother without anyone's knowledge.

With the bed bugs, we've felt like we're in a no win. When we intervened, he escalated and convinced our mom that "everyone is against me." Had we not intervened, I'm convinced he would have infested her home. Keep in mind, when my sister told him that he needed to get it treated so he didn't infest anyone his response was, "It's my choice when and where I see her." Even after he crashed my mom's car, he managed to convince her that he was the victim and that "the whole family is against me." You're right Dianne. He's brainwashed her enough to convince her that she's the only one who can protect him. The cancer diagnosis kind of seals the deal.

Yes, our mom has/had a lot of friends outside of him, but as his isolation tactics have increased she's not got the emotional energy to reach out to people.

Will she come and stay with any of us right now? Not with me. She's very mad at me for even bringing this up, for yelling at her, and for telling her that she was lying for him. (She was.) I'm not sure if she will stay with any of my other siblings. I think she feels like she has to be "on-call" for him.

One of the things that I've noticed is not that he openly violates boundaries. He slowly erodes them. He didn't steal her car. He slowly took it over. My husband and I offered to split the cost of a car for him with our mother so it would take some of the pressure off. He refused saying, "There will be conditions attached if they are involved." Translation: "If I use your car, I can just bulldoze you. No questions asked."

You mentioned about drugs and alcohol. I'm pretty sure he does not currently use. He was quite a drunk for years. When he got his first cancer diagnosis about 10 years ago (this current diagnosis is a recurrence), he quit drinking. Until recently, I don't think that he's had the money to buy drugs.

One of the things that I find most confusing is that he elicits feelings and thoughts from me like: hatred; ambivalence about his cancer; relief when he dies; etc. Wow.


Edited by twin (09/09/10 08:05 PM)

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#9990 - 09/08/10 09:45 AM Re: Brother is anti social I need help [Re: twin]
Dianne E. Offline

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Personally I am not a therapist but I think it is part of the normal process in our minds during times like this; the trick is to get to our center and not let anger toward him harm your own life. I recently have been going through a nasty process with my mom's husband; even though he isn't a Psychopath I do find myself having wretched thoughts at times. I have to get in the present moment to not avoid but to process them. My brother is the only person I can express these thoughts to in order to put them into perspective. From what I have found is that pain drags us into areas that will only harm us in the end when I go into that deep hole of resentment. Trust me; some very awful things have passed through my mind and some of them were dozesí. We are on our own path and Psychopathís can suck the blood out of us if allowed.

I would guess that you mom doesnít have many friends to speak of.

Boundaries and Psychopath are not like a "normal" person would process boundaries. I suspect he has broken down every boundary your mother ever has had. The blame game is the victim game; no one can help him better than the actual victim being your mother.

If at all possible due to your motherís age it might help you, not him to eat some crow and stay away from any conversations about him and focus your attention to her. She is the one that is getting the sad and confused end of the deal. All of this is really beyond your control to try to change her. Your brother has control over her thoughts and actions. All a person can do in a situation like this is to remember the mother you love/loved with unconditional emotions. She should be the only one to concern yourself with. It will be hard even hearing what she says your brother is up to but if you make it about your love for her in the end you will feel better about your relationship in the end. It is 100% unlikely he will change. Your mother will continue to be in his web of evil and there is probably no hope there, look at your mother as a victim of a very evil person, that doesn't make her evil but probably a lonely person with poor boundaries and brain washed.

Fighting against him will only harm your mother who has her own belief system that this is what she should or has been told to do.

Just out of curiosity did the family member who took your brother to the clinic actually go in during the examination?

Throw your brother off his game by focusing on your mother. He enjoys the divide and conquer plan. If you were to only focus on your mother and her needs he will have less to say to confirm how everyone is against him. When/if she brings him up try as hard as you can to be positive/change the subject and to be neutral without encouraging his actions or conversations about him. His actions will only drive a bigger wedge with your mother, that is what your brother expects to happen. When other siblings are letting your brother get to him it is like handing him some ammunition to report to your mom about what he perceives about what unsupportive creeps you are. When you have to be around your brother alone like the trip to the clinic just have some standard replies like, oh gee that doesn't sound good or I am sorry it must be terrible to be in your situation, etc. stay away from calling him out on the creep and damage he is doing to your mom. He has done an excellent job of dividing your entire family with you elderly mom in the center, that is how evil works.

Di

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#9991 - 09/08/10 10:39 AM Re: Brother is anti social I need help [Re: Dianne E.]
twin Offline
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Registered: 09/05/10
Posts: 74
Yes the SIL (sister-in-law) went into the examination with him. She also helped him complete his paperwork for disability so she saw some of the actual current medical reports. Believe me, there were a few of my siblings who thought the same thing -- could he be manufacturing this diagnosis to get sympathy and gain control of my mom.

You are right that we need to focus on our mom. The situation with the bed bugs is one of those things in which sometimes you can do the right thing and it can still turn out terribly. We needed to stand up to him about the bed bugs because if he infested her home that would terrible for her and it would also jeopardize those of us who regularly care for her. I would risk bringing it back to my house and my sister would risk bringing it back to her house.

When I discovered the situation with the car and the money a few years ago, I discussed this with her and it didn't go well then either. I decided that I would do my best to support her and protect her without bringing up his name. The whole time I watched him slowly erode at her. My sister and I were the ones who took her to the pulmonologist and the cardiologist when she was having stress-related heart problems and breathing problems. It is very difficult to watch the effect of it on her. I've decided that he's a bulldozer, but he's a slow moving one. If he were fast or abrupt, it would be obvious that he were running her over. He's more gradual, but the damage is the same.

I try to see her as a victim of him. My sister and I were just talking about this. We don't expect her to be able to confront him or stand up to him. We just expect her to not attack us when we don't immediately fall for his cons immediately. That is the very hurtful part for us.

It's useless. He'll slowly destroy her. To offer her support gives me a front row seat to the destruction. To distance myself gives him more access to her.

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#9992 - 09/08/10 01:20 PM Re: Brother is anti social I need help [Re: twin]
Dianne E. Offline

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Hi, it must very difficult to have to sit and watch his destruction. I agree, I think slowly they gather trust and present what they say has a ring of truth; they are masters at control and isolating others.

To have it be your mother must be horrible, she should be enjoying her life. Are any of her friends left that she used to have? I would guess he would be an active participant in getting rid of them; just his presence when they would visit would probably do it.

It is sad to have a front row seat. I can't imagine how difficult that must be. At a minimum it might defuse some of his lies. He is like a cult leader with one member. Not to be rude and you certainly don't have to answer, does your mom have any assets? Thinking out loud could a conservatory type person take charge of her expenses to not let him get every dime due to her health and age so he can't wipe her clean?

Do you for any reason think the heart/stress reaction is because deep down she knows the truth but is unable to deal with being deceived by someone she brought into this world? It is common for this to happen, a parent can be like a turtle when they sense trouble, ducking under their shell is safer and less to acknowledge.

By now I suspect he has her convinced he is the only one for her. Many times people just canít face the reality of someone, particularly their own child can be so callous and evil.

Di

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#9993 - 09/08/10 09:31 PM Re: Brother is anti social I need help [Re: Dianne E.]
twin Offline
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Registered: 09/05/10
Posts: 74
Thank you so much for your kind and compassionate response. I think that some of her stress is that at some level -- deep down -- she knows. The only thing that seemed to penetrate her denial was to point out to her in obvious terms that he took her car while she was in the hospital and yet rarely seemed to make it to visit her. And to point out that when she stayed with me for two months, he rarely called to check on her well-being. Why? He couldn't get anything from her.

My sister is a co-something on her bank account. I don't think that he'd completely empty her out. Instead, he nickle/dimes her to death. Meanwhile, another brother stopped by his apartment and spotted a check from another older lady for $100. He's always conning someone.

I've read more information about psychopathy and in particular it's genetic origins. I've wondered if he is some variant of autism or schizoid or schizotypal. None of that addresses his parasitic behavior, his arrogance, his refusal to accept responsibility, his pathological lying, his manipulations, his glib disregard for the impact of his behavior on anyone. The genetic origins of this scare the "bee-jesus" out of me given that I have children of my own. Every developmental mis-step they make sends me into a panic that "they may turn out just like him."

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#9995 - 09/09/10 01:56 PM Re: Brother is anti social I need help [Re: twin]
Dianne E. Offline

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Hi Twin,

What a relief your sister has signing abilities for your mom. Does your sister give your mom money for things or does it come out of the joint account? I know here it can be set up so that both parties have to sign for a check, which would narrow the field a bit.

I would rest about your children. Just like a horrible car crash can happen we all know they happen but will it happen to us? Not likely.

Outside of the typical signs, which would be quite visible you probably don't have much to worry about. The conscience forms between 3 - 5. I can certainly understand why you would be concerned but perhaps sometimes we can see things that aren't really an issue based on information about some other person's behavior.

Do you remember when you started seeing your brother showing signs when you were children?

I feel a great deal of pain for your mother; it must be a horrible thing to think about her own child. All the dreams she must have had and hope for his future. Maybe now she just needs your understanding and compassion because I would be surprised if she ever expresses her doubts. They are probably so hidden inside herself that she herself would probably not have the ability to articulate them. This is just a guess but what would come of her admitting this about your brother, she might feel like a failure as a mother and add to her pain. I would just close any loop, ie. a will where he might benefit etc. and let him know he won't benefit by her not being there.

Parasites run off to find more victims so this woman's check doesn't sound odd. The less your brother thinks he can "get" from your mom the more invisible he will hopefully become. He was certainly able to keep himself busy with other victims while your mom was with you. He will move on when he knows the road is closed and unfortunately for others move onto new and fresh victims. That is all he knows to do. He will always be the victim in his eyes.

He can't be helped, your mother can with your love and compassion.

You are doing a wonderful thing to figure out why all this is happening, information is power. You will always know that you cared so much for your mother to let her live in peace and by being there for her in your own way.

Di

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#9996 - 09/09/10 08:45 PM Re: Brother is anti social I need help [Re: Dianne E.]
twin Offline
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Registered: 09/05/10
Posts: 74
You've helped me so much Dianne. Just to have validation is helpful. I'm a pretty centered person and his antics really set my head spinning at times.

My twin sister and I are the youngest of 8 children. He's been odd for as long as I can remember. My mom said he said that he had SEVERE separation anxiety with his entrance into elementary school. She still expresses frustration that he was pulled away from her daily for weeks if not months.

Our upbringing was pretty tumultuous. The police were frequently called to the house because of physical altercations between my brothers. Truthfully, they're all on the psychopathy spectrum (if there is such a thing) but he's the most severe. Two of my brothers are diagnosed with bi-polar disorder; another has struggled with alcoholism; but this brother is the one who we've referred to as the "pot stirrer." Even when he was in high school and my other siblings were getting summer jobs, he chose to work for a temporary agency and he'd turn down work if he "didn't feel like" working. He went into the military and I think that the secret hope of my parents was that it would straighten him out.

While in the military, he never advanced much past "private" despite being enlisted 9 years. By the way, he dropped out of the military less about 10 months shy of being able to collect a partial military pension. Why? He didn't want to be beholden to anyone. After he left the military, no one (not even my parents) heard from him for about 3 years. When my father was dying, he was spending money he didn't have on trips and vacations. When he died, he was furious that my mom wouldn't delay the funeral indefinitely until he arrived despite him having no money to pay for his airfare to return for the funeral. Throughout all of this, he drank excessively and used drugs. He has a quit date for drinking but never did any of the other work (12 step stuff) that comes along with real recovery.

I remember when my father died, he stirred up some drama despite him not being present throughout his 2 1/2 years of dementia. About 15 years ago, he had his first cancer diagnosis. My poor mother. Her honesty about his issues evaporated with that. I know that she was so fearful that he'd die that she completely collapsed her boundaries. He began living rent-free in her home and then complaining that she wasn't giving him "his space." Hello? That is because the entire space was her's.

I then remember that she started noticing that she was getting spam email messages of a sexual nature and we couldn't figure it out because we'd bought her anti-virus protection. I took her computer to "my computer guy" and he told me that there was porn all over her hard drive. I've got other family members who've caught him viewing porn at her house, but seem to be too intimidated to say anything to him.

My mom has treated him as if he is fragile and powerful all at the same time. He's got great control over her. I've been financially independent since I was 19 y/o. He's been mooching off of her for most of his 57 years.

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#9997 - 09/09/10 08:49 PM Re: Brother is anti social I need help [Re: twin]
twin Offline
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Registered: 09/05/10
Posts: 74
The money comes out of a joint account. The entirety of the assets come from my mom for the account. I help my mom with incidental expenses and a cleaning person. My sister also pays for incidental expenses and also pays for her cell phone. Separate from he, she's a great human being. He's never seen her past his dysfunctional relationship with her.

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#9998 - 09/09/10 11:00 PM Re: Brother is anti social I need help [Re: twin]
Dianne E. Offline

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Hi Twin, he lacks the capability to see anything outside of himself. Very self absorbed. If I have heard it once it has been a million times Psychopath's addiction or whatever toward porn. I have often wondered and maybe because they are not even real to him (actualy like everyone else, just objects). They don't seem to feel any shame when caught. Does he still use your mom's computer? If so there are some kind of locks that can be put onthe computer to block acess. Normally this is for children.

Since you never know what he might do I strongly suggest that you set up your mom's banking account so that it takes two signatures for the bank to give any funds. You never know what kind of sob story or pressure he will use to get what he wants.

It must be very hard on all of his siblings to deal with such a self serving monster.

Can you recall at what age you started noticing things that he was doing that didn't seem right?

It is great that you are using tools to shield your mother from his actions. This way she can have some years left that are conflict free.

I recently went through the death of my mother and I am so thankful that our "issues" were put to the side these last few years and the happy memories are good reminders. It isn't that I am not sad but I am at peace that we had the time we had together without any conflicts and learned more about each other and could laugh together.

Di

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#9999 - 09/10/10 09:38 AM Re: Brother is anti social I need help [Re: Dianne E.]
twin Offline
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Registered: 09/05/10
Posts: 74
I think that I've always known something was different about him. When I was little he seemed to have a good sense of humor, but he never really had a sense of direction or goals. He seems to have wandered aimlessly throughout life. I think that I knew something was "wrong" with him when I was about 12 and he was in his mid-20s. The military was somehow supposed to "fix" him although no one really acknowledged what was wrong. For years, people would hope "he'd grow up" or say "he's just immature." It never happened. At first I thought, "He doesn't need to "grow up." He needs treatment. He can get better if he'd get treatment." I think it is only in the last two years that I realized that treatment couldn't help him. This is a personality disorder.

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