Wow, what a statement, how cold to think your 83 year old mother could even handle caring for anyone yet alone a psychopath.

Blaming life on your parents was the therapy of the 80's, they did the best they could considering their era. I figure my mother got her information from her mother who was raised in the early 1900's.

I don't mean to sound harsh but it sounds like your sister was behind the door when empathy was dished out.

I can't even think of leaving a cat or pet with an 83 year old person let alone a very disturbed person.

I can understand how horrific this must feel to hear these words with such lack of love, sheer respect or concern come out of their mouths. Actually it is a distant cousin to elder abuse.

Unfortunately in most or quite a few families we all can grow up quite differently. You really can't argue to get someone to understand empathy and kindness.

At some point you may need to reach the point to give up on them, they just won't get it. Nothing will make them get it, they want to blame your mother for how they were raised and in reality at some point our hearts open up more when letting go of such hateful thoughts. they aren't near that point yet and may never be. They may have to get moved into your neutral zone to protect your energy.

The core group of you may just well be better off not even getting yourself in a position to hear their ugly thougths. They won't change and to hear them say these things has to be horrily painful.

Di

Dianne -

You are right. We've got to shield ourselves from their insensitivity as well. It is an energy drain that I can't tolerate right now. I think that I'm learning to let go of a lot right now. I've got to let go of my expectations that they will be helpful in this situation because when they are not helpful I do feel let down . . . despite having this big family it is really just me, my sister, and our sister-in-law who understand this.

Hi Twin, when times get tough we soon learn what the others in our life are all about. The previous image would never have allowed these thoughts that they would behave this way.

I was quite serious about Elder Abuse, they take these kind of things very seriously and if your brother is heading in the path to live with your mother I would be looking into it. It would be like watching a speeding train and never bothering to protect the one who needs it, your mom. She may think she can handle it but I hardly think so.

It doesn't sound like your brother hides his attitude and demands and one interview would sum up your concerns. He needs to be in a care facility if that is the way it needs to be, not to push your mom into one because of the way he treats her.

There are lots of places that would take him in, the last place should be your mom.

You now know who your core group is, let go of the others and if they were to ask I am not so sure I would say much. Whatever they say is probably better for you not to hear.

Someone yapping about their childhood idicates their lack of ability to be sensitive to others, still focused on the past. In a way it is almost like a veiled deal to say, she didn't treat me so hot so why are you bothering me. Our parents did the best they could based on the circumstances, they are not some evil being set out to punish anyone. Besides how many years can a person put the blame on their parents? Empathy is in short supply with them it seems.

Di

Hi Twin,

It's too bad your mom is considering having him move in with her. If that's what your brother's pushing for, it will probably come to pass.

Is there any possibility you could engage more family members into providing Active Assistance? I mean, forget about trying to get them to confront and discuss matters with mom and brother, and instead present them with options for physically DOING more, contributing action. Just because other people have kids, busy family schedule, or demanding jobs, doesn't make it okay for them to shrug off their share of responsibility for Mom (and/or brother) onto you. If they view you as willing and able to support the 'lion's share', they'll let it happen. Do your other family members take you for granted? Have they flatly declined requests to provide assistance?

If others truly can't or won't share in providing active support, it's not unreasonable to ask them to contribute monetary support to hire some help and lighten your burden a bit...a college student to take her shopping or to get her hair done; a cleaning lady, etc. You'll have to be direct and clear with whoever you hire about what service you expect. You said you paid for cleaning services for awhile, but quit after you discovered that your mom sent them over to your brother's house. Why did the cleaning person cooperate with your mom relaying her services over to your brother? Any services YOU hire and pay for, those employees are under contract (or should be) to YOU.

As for your siblings that blame your mom: Co-conspires?!-BS. "Blame the victim" is how people excuse and justify themselves from doing nothing about abusive situations. "It's her own fault; she could prevent it if she wanted to; the way she responds to him is her choice."

From what you've described, I'd guess your mom can't recognize a choice exists really. It takes energy and stamina (in short supply at age 83) to stick up for yourself. And on top of that it's possible she can't reject any of her children without violating deeply ingrained ethical beliefs about loving one's children no matter their faults and imperfections. She's no co-conspirator of your brother's, but her age and style of love enables his victimization of her. He has the mind of a predator, he can't ignore easy prey.

That's all I have to offer at present!

Dear Kate & Dianne,

Thank you for your kind responses. I am embarrassed to say that I'm not sure that I can yet bring Adult Protective Services (Elder Abuse) into this situation yet. It might (and I mean might) protect my mom, but it would permanently and irrevocably end my relationship with her.

Dianne, when you brought it up last year when I began posting it stuck with me. The doctor and the nurse were concerned enough about her well-being that they pulled me aside to ask . . . "Who is Blank? She's always talking about him and how she has to give him money" after she talked about him taking her car and not giving it back AND THEY DIDN'T CALL ADULT PROTECTIVE SERVICES?

Why don't health care workers pick-up on this stuff? I know it doesn't remove my role but if others would pick up on it -- it would take some of the overwhelming weight on us -- the bystanders. Very weighted down right now.

Twin,

About getting help via reporting Elder Abuse, and in reply to your remark that your mom's doctor seemed concerned and why don't 'these people' do more to help (report it themselves.)

When I discovered my father's 'captive victim' situation, the first thing I did was call the Elder Abuse hotline. The bottom line there, was that they could send a person to visit him in his home (investigate my claim he was being abused), and IF my father was able to convey to them that he didn't want to live there, -- wanted to move out, was being mistreated, was frightened -- they could move him out pronto. But, if he did not express that, --if he said that he was okay or things were fine, and if there was no obvious EVIDENCE that he was being abused, the best they could do was convey their concern for his well-being and return for another visit in a week or two to again check up on him.

Every state has different laws regarding the evidence needed to legally remove a person from their home (because of abuse.) Once the abuser gains control over the victim's mind, by terrorizing the victim into believing that no escape is possible, they control what the victim says to others. Unless the victim can express to others a desire to leave, other's can't remove the victim...unless there are obvious signs of physical abuse or clear evidence of mental cruelty...witnessed by an investigator in the home. And lots of times an abuse investigator can't even get INTO the home on the first visit. After several visits have been attempted, a relative can make a charge of abuse, to the police or sheriffs office, which enables officers to demand entrance, but once inside, they face the same challenges -- will the victim state he is being mistreated, is there EVIDENCE of mistreatment...or will the victim say they are just fine (from fear of what their abuser will do to them if they don't support the abuser.) If they say they are fine, and there's no clear evidence of abuse, the officers can't do anything.

Document your evidence. Write down dates, times and descriptions of your verbal exchanges, things you see and hear. That can help.
RECORD your mother telling you about your brother's ill treatment, exploitation, misuse of her. You may need it.

By the time I discovered how rotten matters were in my fathers home, his mind was shot from her abuse. He wasn't thinking logically. He was so terrified of her, he was consumed with following her commands and doing and saying nothing that would invite more physical abuse. He was certain that it wasn't safe for him to say anything against her or about what was going on, because if he did she would KNOW and would inflict more injury and pain on him or kill him. He could not believe that anyone had the power to extract him from the nightmare.

When I was unable to talk with him on the phone, having for the umpteenth reached only his wife who gave yet another excuse for why he couldn't talk to me now...I told her I was coming to visit, tomorrow. She said it wasn't necessary, would be a waste of my time because he really wasn't in shape to visit and slept most of the time, etc etc. She tried hard to dissuade me from coming but I refused to be dissuaded, told her it didn't matter to me if he slept, I didn't expect or require entertainment, and my son wanted to see his Grandpa--had Veteran's Day off-school and could take Monday off as well--so we'd arrive there on Sat afternoon, and be leaving first thing Tues morning. We would spend part of Sun and Mon in the city (an hours drive from their home) visiting the zoo and museum, and a cousin. My Dad's wife was all about posing as if things were fine, she was taking good care of him, nothing was wrong.
When I arrived there he was lying on his back on the couch, very thin and with an ashen complexion, covered with a blanket, seemingly asleep. The only words he spoke to me that day were a slurred greeting, "Hi honey, nice to see you." He was asleep the entire evening. SHE told me it was his medications. She left him on the couch overnight, making a show of putting another blanket on and adjusting the pillow under his head so he'd be 'comfy.' The next day she wanted to go shopping, I declined to join her; it was obvious from her expression and voice that she didn't want to leave me and my son "alone" with my father. She stood in the doorway staring hard at us in a calculating way, my son was watching TV, I had begun reading a book I brought with me, Dad was asleep on the couch, she said 'Well...I won't be gone long. Just make sure you don't DISTURB him, he needs his sleep.' She left. Five minutes later my Dad asked, "Is she gone?" I said "yes" -- he said, "Go outside, make SURE her car is gone." I did and so reported. He then said, "I have to get out of here, if I stay here I'll die, she'll kill me." I was all for leaving right then and there. He said no, he couldn't hardly move, he was in too much pain to stand and walk, couldn't make it to the door or the car, couldn't endure the car ride an hour to the city...if I could find his pain pills, maybe we could leave. She had hidden them and all his medications; she hadn't given him any, until yesterday when she made him swallow something shortly before we arrived, that knocked him out soon after (hence his slurred greeting and then he was out.) He said she had taken him to see the doctor for his follow-up exam a week after his surgery (maintaining a pretense of normalcy)...and threatened him that if he said anything bad about her to the doctor or let on that anything was wrong, she would make him hurt so much that he would wish he was dead--he couldn't tell the doctor anything! She stayed with him throughout his appointment, telling the doctor he'd been a 'bad boy' about his medications and didn't want to take them, 'but SHE was a NURSE and SHE was taking GOOD CARE of him.' The doctor was concerned that there was bruising around the site of his incision, and some seepage from it, but he couldn't, didn't dare! tell the doctor that she had hit him there...the doctor wouldn't believe him, and even if he did?--so what?--what could the doctor DO?--she would deny that there was anything wrong, blame it on him somehow, say he fell down or something, and in the end the doctor would caution him to be more careful and he would be leaving in HER company under HER care, helpless to drive or get away from her.

Kate,

I'm so sorry about what your dad experienced. I know how painful it is to have a court side view of the destruction.

My mother's abuse is not physical so there would be no bruises to document, but I do look for them. If an investigator interviewed her to check on her well-being, it would produce nothing. My mom is so used to being USED she would say everything was okay. Once, my husband asked her about the stress of the situation and she responded, "(Blank) isn't a bother."

I'm headed out to run errands. Lots to think about as always. Sometimes I just wish my mind would be able to rest.

Hi Twin,

Back to your posting 2/17 about Doctors and nurses don't report the "concerns" they have about patients.

If they're suspicious of emotional abuse they do what they did with you: mention it to next of kin. When they see a patient who has obvious signs of physical abuse they'll note the injuries in the patient's medical report but they may still not alert police or social workers. Nobody wants to report trouble if trouble doesn't really exist (they are not in a position to be able to determine that with certainty, which is why they express their concerns to family); some feel it's pointless to report when the suspected victim denies the problem. The doctor who assessed and treated my father after he escaped from his wife, said Dad's condition was in his medical report, which Dad's lawyer could order copies of, but the doctor wouldn't offer personal testimony unless he was subpoenaed to give it.

Years ago when I was attempting to obtain a court order of protection to force my husband to move out, I needed witnesses willing to document/testify about abuse incidents. Among others, I asked a counselor at my daughter's school if she would document an incident that occurred in the school office with her and my daughter. She said she would give documentation only if subpoenaed, "because the school didn't want to appear to involve itself in domestic disputes." It was so hypocritical. She had phoned me at home immediately following the incident, upset and shocked, asking ..."was my husband under the care of a psychiatrist?- he needed to be!--never in her 15 years of dealing with parents had she heard a father use such foul language and behave so inappropriately with staff that they had to threaten to call the police to make him leave!" Instead of reporting him, she threatened to report ME to social services (for having an unsafe home, because he was in it.) I already was doing everything possible to get him OUT of it. Thankfully, other people were willing to come forward for us (me and the kids.)


If taking any action to protect your mom from your brother will end your good relationship with your mom,
that pretty much seals the deal, unless his emotional manipulation escalates to a point where your mom finds it intolerable.
If you haven't already spoken with Adult Protective Services it'd be a good idea to call them and find out what services they offer in your state/city, just so you know. (I don't remember if you said you'd done that and can't refer to your earlier post while in this Reply field.)


Bottom line?...You can only do, what you can do... and don't beat yourself up for what's NOT possible to do.

I wish you a nice day!