Hi Little Deb



It is highly likely that since "Wayne" is a probably well socialized Psychopath he may just in fact be acting like he loves his son. It isn't possible for them to love or care for anyone but themselves, but a good actor could give that impression.

Does Wayne have visitation, what is the situation?



I think that in retrospect some things are just easier to see. It was many years ago and I suspect you probably had the feeling he was either just going through some stage, please know you did everything you could. It would have been hard that many years ago with such a little discussed topic in general even today to have put the pieces together back then.

I am truly sorry for your situation, it must be the worst pain a parent has to face.

Di

Dianne,
Wayne's son was about 2 years old when the kidnapping happened. April (I will call the mother), said that I could still see my grandchild. She however, has a very bad temper and especially when she was young,would take my grandson away for 6 months or more at a time. I have continued to work at this relationship and contact with my grandson since. He is a caring child.

When Wayne got out of prison the only way that he could see his son was under supervision in a room. My grandson was about 7 at this time. They did hit it off. Wayne told me that he had wispered to his son "that they were smarter than everyone else". It wasn't long before Wayne couldn't stand the little room and wanted to see his son over at my home. April agreed to this under my supervision. First time at my house and Wayne had walkie talkie's and wanted to use them at another place. I told him that he couldn't go anywhere with his son. I left the room so that he could have some private time. I heard the car start up, and he was gone... I was in a frantic. I looked at my daughters, my mom's, his dad's and on my way home I was thinking, " Am I going to have to call the law on my own son?" When I arrived at home, I saw their shoes on my porch so I knew that they had come back by. I left again and saw Wayne's car at my mom's. Wayne came out with his smile and getting in my space.."Oh Mom I am sooo happy, and he is having such a good time. etc" And all I could think about was getting past Wayne without him getting angry and getting my grandson in my possesion. I managed. I took my little grandson home and put him on my lap and told him"What a complicated little life you have, That both his Mom and his Dad loved him, but his Mom had custody and so anytime that Wayne wanted him to go anywhere with him, just tell him that "you have to say Bye to Grandma" and I would let you know if you could go".
I told April and she said that she would let me handle it. So I talked to Wayne and on another date (he bought a 4 wheeler just for this) where he could take his son riding for 20 minutes. My Mom, Wayne's step children, My daughter and her son where at my house and for the first time in such a long time, I felt like a family. Short lived though, April got mad and took my grandson away again and I didn't see him until two years ago.

No Wayne couldn't see him. But about 5 months ago the father of April's 2 girls was killed in an auto accident and she felt bad that they hadn't seen their father in a year. She told me that Wayne could see my grandson. My grandson is not ready. Another story, another time.

I have always felt like I need to protect the heart and mind of my grandson through everything. Still do. But, now I have more information than I did before and I don't want my grandson to be ripped apart emotionally. So, how do I accomplish this? Don't know yet. He is but 15. Girls, school, puberty, friends, driving, what to do with my life?, etc. is his life right now. And this new found knowledge is really enough for me right now and I will find a way to continue to protect my little grandson.

Thanks for being there,

Hi Little Deb, I can't imagine the pain all these years have brought to you. You are a wonderful grandmother to protect your grandson. The truth while it is hard to deal with will help.

If you don't mind my asking what was "Wayne" in prison for?

I don't know if you are able or have explored the option of where your grandson can live. In most states here when a child reaches a certain age they can decide who they want to live with, is this possible for you?

It is possible that he can get a Guardian Ad Litem. Here is a link to the information here at the forum

Legal Resources

Di

Wayne was in prison for kidnapping April the day before the custody hearing. Because he went across state line it went federal.

My grandson is with his mother. Even though she has anger issues, stress of being a single mom. She really is an OK mom. My grandson is a good natured young man. He likes people and goes out of his way to make a person's day. I have decided that he really doesn't need to see Wayne. And other than court, he doesn't have any way of seeing him but through me, and after his latest anger thing and the information I have found out, I am not leaving a door open for that. I really don't want to tell my grandson that his father is a pshycopath, nor do I want to tell April.

Grandmothers, we have been children and have raised children and grandchildren are gifted with the knowledge and love that we have. I don't think that seeing Wayne or even knowing about him is best. My grandson should be enjoying his teen years.

In the first post I did talk a little about the kidnapping, but as I look back I wonder what all were just mirrors and flash.


again, thanks

Little Deb, every child would be lucky and fortunate to have a grandmother like you in their lives.

I think you are right in not telling April and your grandson what Wayne really is, at least not now. I am not for keeping family secrets but he is too young and would be too much for him.

Because Psychopathy is a genetic thing, there might be a time that he should know before he has kids of his own to make an informed decision.

I never really knew my grandparents and I would pick you if I had the choice, you are wonderful for all your support and love you are giving.

Di

Thanks Dianne,

Things are quiet right now, but I won't know when and where things will start up again. The drama just comes from left field most of the time. I will write again. Thank you for being there, it is a little better when you know someone else understands, even just a little.

Hi Little Deb, I know it must be a horrible thing to know when the left field curve might hit. Now that you know what he is I feel like knowledge is power and you know what you are dealing with.

Your grandson is one lucky person to have you in his corner.

Di

Well, it might have been quiet for me for just a few days. My step mom took me to lunch (she had invited me two weeks ago-"because I have been so sweet by checking on her weekly since her son died a couple of months ago"), I have been sick so I called her today to see about lunch.

When she sat down, she took my hands and had to talk to me about Wayne and his wife Mary. Things were awful. Mary lost her custody case (her daughter) and it hadn't even went to trial and they didn't know why and they were just so upset. My step mom was worried about her committing suicide and Wayne as well, a double suicide, because he was soooooo upset about not being able to see his son. That he has been calling her crying and that April is the key in his son not coming to see him.

She started talking about her son and when they fought he would always call and they would make up. Even if she thought that he was 100 percent at fault she would take 50 percent of the blame. "forgive 70 times 7". All this was a manipulation to make up with Wayne. No he has not called me to say I am sorry or anything else. Wayne calls my step mom because she thinks he is gorgeous, the best looking one in the family. He charms her. Now he is playing her to get me to talk to April about seeing his son.

My step mom said that April was vicious and that she was a Psychopath. Can you believe that? I kept my thoughts to myself and let her continue to talk. I didn't reveal what I was thinking, nor made any comments that she could repeat, in or out of context.

I changed the subject to her and how she was feeling and made it through lunch.

Wayne wants to see his son.......this is not over.

More to come, I am sure