Said therapist lectured me, repeatedly, to let Psychopath have his job, to not ruin that for him, to not turn his family against him. She was clearly agonized that I had turned his children against him. In her view, I was taking everything away from him. I did not do any of that. There was a leak into his job community about his office affair. I was not responsible for the leak. I never spoke to his family about the problems, at all, ever (she got the idea I would turn them all against him from Psychopath; my sin was apparently inviting them to my daughter's baby shower). I did not turn his youngest daughter against him. She put him out of her life after he beat me, for the hundredth time, and held me captive with a knife for many hours, and I called her, afterwards, out of need. Okay, I did that. But I did not mean to turn her against him; I tried to talk her into being chummy with him, again, afterwards (I was sick).

When we reconciled, briefly, the therapist lectured me, endlessly, that I had better darn well be having sex with him. She was worried that I wouldn't play fair with poor Psychopath. Me being such a mean, spiteful person.

And people wonder how we who were so victimized could have stayed so long. Here was a credentialed therapist who was not in love with the man, hadn't had his children, hadn't been his wife for decades, had never suffered any abuse, but knew about it, and blamed it all on me. The psychopath was that good. If he could convince her it was all me, how much more easily could he convince me?

And she was not the first therapist to blame it all on me. I believe she was the fourth. Which is all of them, except for the first and the last.

The therapy situation is appalling. No one should be permitted to work with a psychopath's victim who is not very specially trained. Better yet, all those who do should have experience with psychopaths.

A few years, I met a young woman through a circumstance involving a psychopath. The psychopath was serving a prison sentence for raping her younger sister, who had been 11, at the time, 6, when the molesting began.

As in so many of these circumstances, these girls' mother was also a psychopath. I was going through an intense awakening period regarding psychopathy, and the gripping awareness that my husband was a psychopath.

This young woman's mother had been convicted of embezzling funds from her company, but had escaped with probation "because she had children at home to care for". She had stolen an inheritance left to her daughters. The man who raped her daughter was the mother's boyfirend. She married him after his conviction. She spread rumors through the town that her daughter had seduced him, and her daughter was osctracized. She had to leave town. The town took to holding prayer vigils for the rapist.

I was talking with this young woman, the victim's older sister. I was describing my husband's horrible acts, and how he emerged from every situtaion smelling like a rose.

She said, "My mother could have been found with a bloody knife dripping over her dead grandmother, on the town square, and she would have walked away from it, wearing a medal."

People who haven't been harmed by a psychopath just have no idea what this is about. It's about evil. And through ignorance, many participate in that evil.

kris,
Yes, I'm curious to see if anyone there drew any further conclusions than BPD. Yep, it's still not politically correct to say some people are beyond help, I appreciate your irony!
I see where I have these huge holes in my personality, probably stemming from my mother's acceptance of my father's abuse. And I thought I never absorbed any of her lessons, because I was the one who fought for her? Hah! Doh! Surprise, surprise.
Thanks for the warning about therapists, your experience is appalling. Unless you're dead, will anyone take a woman's complaints seriously. Some things never change, even in 2002.
A new Zen koan: what is the sound of you biting your own butt?

I fell, I like that: what is the sound of you biting your own butt?

I know a Zen thought isn't supposed to have a response, but this is what came to my mind: It is the sound of a soundless primal scream.

Well Dianne,

These two seem to be close on the mark of my "little guy", now 25, criminal
record and all.

It is the oddest thing you know. I have a friend, a lot younger than I am.
His Father is my age. And this friend is the most professional sort-
knowledgeable, decent, hard working- the very best kind of man. And he
confided to me that his young brother, 25, is like my son. Stealing money,
getting into hellish accidents, not interested in anything, no sport, no
computers, no nothing. Stealing from employers that know his Dad, and who
for that reason took him on. And, recently ill, he had of course to get the
nurse pregnant. You know, just to put the point on it. The girl turned up at
my friend's Fathers house explaining, and demanding. Frankly, I wonder if
she isn't the same type as the boy, and set the stupid boy up. For my
friend's Father is commander of a highly specialised navy ship, and thus the
boy is from a regarded family. Of course, I asked laughingly how the
preparations for the nuptuals were coming on. My friend, the brother of this
guy said succinctly- I don't know, and frankly speaking i don't want to
know. And he is not a dismissive sort, or immune to other's problems.
Fortunately for him, he is only a brother. The Father for now apparently
pretends toughness. I mean, he would, wouldn't he? But the boy still lives
with him. And, in that far country, Navy Commander or not, there is not much
money to spare.

It all appears to come from nowhere, and is so, so saddening.

Rgds Ian

by all means post this if you feel it worth while

Hi rick. I couldn't reply to your post? We officially broke up on June 12th, 2003 (10 months ago) but I guess it really ended for me when I found out about infidilities in 1998 and 1999. I was just living in some stupid fantasy world, imagining these things weren't really happening but deep down inside I knew things were terribly wrong and was searching for many years for an answer.

You were right! within 24 hours I received a text message. He said, 'sorry about yesterday things were a little awkward, sorry it was abit unexptected, I was shocked, you can be my friend if you respect me and my relationship, if you are pleasant next time you can be introduced to her'.

He is such a creep I can't believe it. If our paths should cross again I will be ignoring him next time.



Just needed to share... I ran into my ex P today. I knew this day would eventually come. Yes, he was with his latest victim. It truly was a freak coincedence as he was some 330 kilometres from his home and I was some 100 kilometres away from my home on vacation. (1 mile = 1.6 km). The most wonderful part is I had literally stepped out of a beauty salon and felt and looked a million bucks if I may say so. I had my hair washed, cut, coloured, streaked and blow dryed and felt on top of the world. Come out and low and behold there he is. He just sort of appeared, I don't even know where he came from, I just looked up and he was there. We both got a shock to tell you the truth, a pure chance encounter. He actually gave me a hug and a kiss (trying to look good for the new girlfriend I suppose who probably has no clue that I am the ex of 8 years and was probably fed some pack of lies if she latered enquired of who I was). He looked terrified that I was going to be vocal about a few things but I wasn't. I just asked him was he well? and said I'll see you later then. I felt empowered by this experience, I feel truly grateful that he is no longer in my life and is now someone elses problem. I know this is mean and I have nothing against the new girl but deep down inside I was pleased to see that the girlfriend is NOT very attractive at all. I guess you always fear they will look like a model.

Anyway just needed to post.

NDWB...

Wow!!! I have gone through the scenario countless times as to how I would act should I happen to bump into my P. I'm sure it will happen eventually, when I least expect it. How wonderful that it occurred when you were feeling so good about yourself. And it sounds like you handled it brilliantly... particularly since it has only been 9 months since the two of you broke up. (I think I'm correct with that figure.) In any event, don't be surprised if this guy tries to contact you via telephone or e-mail. Have you thought about how you would handle that at this point?

Rick

I too agree that it is futile to try to have a real relationship with a P.

I have just come to the realization with the help of a therapist that my mother is one. In addition she sustained a head injury several years ago with injury to the frontal lobes, resulting in 'pseudopsychopathy', so this just caused intense added problems.

After the injury when I realized that my mother was telling my 7 year old daughter she was stupid, exposing herself to my daughter, telling my daughter that my daughter didn't love her, that I didn't love my daughter..etc..on and on and on, I tried to get my mother back to her neurologist and Dr. She was not so impaired that she was nonfunctional- in fact she was/is very functional, she was just an emotional monster- a lot less subtle but much the same as she always was, I realize now.

She would refuse to get in the car to go to appointments, would call and cancel the Dr. app'ts I had made for her. I had already started my daughter and myself in counselling. We lived with my mother since my daughter was a baby.

I asked my sister to help me with an intervention with my mother, but she refused. My mother -unknown to me at the time was telling my sister that I was persecuting her, and trying to put her 'away'. I did not know this-my sister never told me this- until about three years later. I also found out that my mother had been telling her friends and neighbors that I was doing this to her. No one came to me and told me or asked me about it. My mother is very very convincing and can evoke most people's pity very well.

I remember that she did this to the children in our family concerning our dad- actually turned us against him- by lying about him. Since he probably did not know what she was saying and my mother was pretty sure we would not ask him about what all she was saying about him, I imagine his life was a living hell.

I recognize now the strategies she is using on me were the same she used on him. She tells people lies about you, tells them she is afraid of you and your 'anger', somehow gets these people not to verify what all she is saying, by coming to you and clearing the air, and then watches while people start to avoid you, and stop talking to you. Then acts very innocent when you remark at how many people have stopped associating or talking to you.My mother used my fathers' drinking as a weapon against him- alot of people simply believed her lies because after all, he drank too much....I am an unwed mother and have been in recovery in AA for 17 years, and I believe my mother has used the 'undesirable person' strategy and her own squeaky clean image-and its just an image- to do her dirty work.

My sister finally told me all the garbage my mother had been telling her about the things I was supposedly doing to her; yet all the while I was consulting therapist after therapist and head injury resources to try to get all of us help. My sister knew this, yet never confronted my mother, or told me the scope of my mother's smear campaign-in our own family.My sister also didn't want my mother mad at her- the inheritance you know.

My sister told me in the last month, when I told her I just couldn't handle it anymore, that if she stood up for me to mom, that mom would get mad at her, and cut her out of the will. Therefore it was better for me to simply keep taking mom's abuse until she died- she now has cancer-Also if I angered mom, then I probably would get cut out of her will - but not to worry, my sister would make sure that I had a home and money to live on if that happened.

I am disabled with a physical chronic illness. I also had a breakdown three years after my mother's head injury when she became friends with a weird man younger than herself, who I didn't want around my daughter and I. When I told my mother this she simply told me that if I didn't like it I could arrange not to be there when he came over. She also told me that she would 'be sure to tell him 'I said he was weird.Apparently she did. I was harrassed, had weird phone calls and followed to my sister's home when I tried to get away from all this garbage. I could not prove it was him doing this- I did call the police- .I started being unable to sleep, and having panic attacks. My mother thought this was very amusing.I finally stressed out so I actually went to mental institution for a week and was given medication.My mother arranged this with a counsellor she had once seen.Nice of her to help wasn't it?

I would have left but I had nowhere to go.I had no money, and my mother told me she couldn't afford to help me move out. My sister had made it clear she did not want my daughter and with her-150 miles away.She also did not want my mother with her.

After this my mother suddenly 'found ' the money to help me and my daughter move out. Now that I was 'certifiably a 'nut' in her eyes, and she could tell her lies bolstered by the fact that I had had a breakdown, why she was nice as could be.


I am so angry at both her and my sister. There is no point and nothing to reach in my mother. She is sweet as can be most of the time and totally denies she says and does the things she has done and is doing. She has the pastor , and two elders of our church fooled. She eats breakfast with them every Sunday morning.I had left this church and taken my daughter out, and we didn't attend for almost a year. Then my mother had the pastor call my daughter. Apparently he seemed to feel it was perfectly fine to call a 12 year old and speak privately to her, by passing me as her parent. God knows what my mother had told him to make him feel this was warranted.

When I confronted the pastor, he just said he was concerned about my daughter's nonattendance.I found it very odd that he didn't have a woman to call a female child, or that he didn't speak to ME about my daughter's nonattendance, like an upfront porfessional person would. Strange that no one from the church called unless we attended other denominations. This happened twice and each time my daughter 'mysteriously' would stop wanting to go to the other churches.

If this had happened in an open atmosphere, I could have dealt with this better. But it was done in secrecy and behind my back. My daughter and I still did not attend my mothers' church until she became ill with cancer- then suddenly my daughter wanted to go back to this church.

She was now 14 and she told me that if I didn't take her she would just get her grandmother to take her. So I did.My daughter is very happy there. I am happy for her, but I am not happy there, yet I want to be there to watch over her. I am at the point where I hardly trust anyone; either because I have no idea what my mother has said to them- I can imagine she wouldn't let the chance go by to tell people that I am a 'mental case'- I am just exhausted now.

I almost just don't care anymore what she says or does. I have no allies except my counsellor. I do not want to confuse and divide my daughter further- she has had enough of that.

I have tried to have a life that reduces my mother's contact and influence as much as possible. I am somewhat dependant on my mother financially, and there is the problem.

I just wish that I had really recognized and admitted to myself what my mother was and is years ago, and moved to the other side of the country.I now realize what she did to my father, and to my brother- he killed himself on my parents wedding anniversary- two years after my father killed himself.All my mother had to say about that was..."what a waste". I never saw her cry for either my brother or my father. My brother was only 19.These both happened almost thirty years ago.I cannot even make myself think what she must have done to my brother and the manipulation and lies she told about my father.After therapy I remembered her exposing herself to us as kids, and seeing to for what it is: sexual abuse.

I have arranged for my child's guardian to be someone other than my sister, in the event of my death. I plan to keep hanging in there and speaking truth to my daughter as much as I can.As long as I can.

Thanks for this forum:

Hi Alexa,

Welcome to the forum - glad you found it. I read through your post - those are terrible experiences to have gone through. I know these problems must seem completely overwhelming to you right now and perhaps have seemed that way for a long time. Many of us who post here have had experiences with psychopathic personalities in varying degrees and it can leave one feeling helpless and drained. You must have a great deal of mental strength to have come this far.

It is especially difficult when these circumstances happen in families because we are all conditioned to think of family members as the people we would normally turn to for support in distressing circumstances.

I know what it's like to have things said about you behind your back that misrepresent who you are and create an image of you that's negative and misleading. It really is a form of psychological harassment and particularly bad because as you know it is difficult to address directly. I also can relate to the natural anger at being victimized like that and feeling like your rights are being trampled upon and at the same time others are ignoring it as if it isn't taking place. In my view, it's a feeling of being trapped because of not knowing how to alleviate the frustration and usual obsessive thoughts that occur in situations like that.

Please try to find every and all ways of making yourself feel better both emotionally and physically. I have found that even simple things like trying to eat healthy, getting some exercise (as difficult as it is to do that when someone is already feeling drained), reading motivational quotes and other positive books, listening to music or something else that you enjoy and that will help divert your mind and most of all trying to surround yourself with people who are supportive really go a long way in helping one cope. It's good that you have a counsellor - that makes a big difference to help sort through the issues.

I think it's also a good sign that you said you almost don't care what your mother says or does anymore because in my view, that shows that her actions will perhaps be less likely to hurt you if you can adopt that attitude. I know it must be difficult for your daughter as well and it's heartening to see how you try to protect her.

I encourage you to look up information on the internet about coping strategies, dealing with stress, etc. I have found that sometimes even the smallest changes can make a big difference in helping one feel better and more hopeful.

You take care,

Sylvie

my in-law is a psychpath and terroizes and threatens all of us. They are getting divorced. What should I expect from the psychopath in law.

Also this is my first time here ana how do I post a new thread? Thanks and I'm glad I found this place. It's almost a relief to know I'm not so along and there are alot of people who have to deal with people like this. I was amazed.