Dear HereIam... My heart goes out to you. I'm sure your life is very difficult because of this monster. Your P sounds like a horrendous excuse for a human being. I'm sure having your daughter with him is driving you bananas. How old is she? What does she say about living with him? It's hard to believe with all those illegal things he's done, that he is a "free" man! He WILL pay for his mistakes, though. Somewhere - down the road -in this life - or the next - he WILL PAY! (KARMA!) Please keep posting and keeping us informed. All I can do is offer my support and encouragement -that as bad as things are - they WILL get better. We are all here for you and will help any way possible. Love, Tiasa

Hi Here I am...

First, my heart totally aches for you. I cannot imagine my child being kept from by such a person. Not one who I had previously shared every day with... it stupifies me to comprehend. A close friend is experiencing the same... and I grieve her situation daily. I suffered a miscarriage in March due to an assault by the P, and struggle daily with my loss.

I too am fairly new to this forum, and unfortunately, am also caught up in the so-called "Justice System". Sadly I am at a point where it is a full time job. I have had him arrested 3x now,and also turned him in to child protective for physical abuse of his son, which I witnessed. Being the master manipulator he is, he has filed 2 complaints against me, in 2 different courts near him that are (of course) COMPLETE LIES in retaliation to my actions to be rid of him.

I have not had much success with the justice system either so far, but he is currently facing felony assault, criminal contempt (of my order of protection) and aggravated harassment. I am facing FALSE charges on harassment, then violating his order of protection. (which NEVER should have happened, since I have several against him.) In any event, any advice to share? I go to court for the 7th time tomorrow, this time with a DV advocate, ( many thanks to Panamint!!!) & highly recommend that you find support agencies to help you. They are free, confidential and these people know not only the subject matter, but the "politics" in court. Than can make all the difference, and I had not previously considered that perspective.

I read your story and started to shake imagining the pain, frustration and how helpless you feel. I feel that way too, some days more than others. Please know my thoughts and prayers are with you... and tell yourself my new mantra... good prevails over evil. Don't give up the fight!!!!

Hugs,

stunnedhun23

Is anyone watching Dr. Phil? The subject is how custody battles affect children.

They're showing a guy who in my opinion comes across like a classic P personality.

Stabbed someone ("in self defense"), the person is now paralyzed. Served time for that. Also, burnt a house, killed his wife's cat, domestic abuse incident(s) and has had 41 different infractions, some major, some minor. People have referred to the scary eyes and psychopathic stare. If he doesn't have it I don't know who does. He's also a meth user.

I guess the issue is that he wants to see his daughter but the wife doesn't think he should. It's interesting to watch the audience because some of them look pretty freaked out.

I have now read Dr Hare's book which gave me a very good insight into the psychopath's way of thinking and way of living. I feel that I need to learn more, especially from others' personal experience on how to decipher the psychopath. If I should ever meet one, I want to be prepared, and I think I allready may know someone. Dr Hare says in his book that all the reading in the world cannot save me from a psychopath's claws. But I still feel like I know too little...

The icy, intense gaze, has anyone experienced that? Dr Hare says it is characteristic, but what if the psychopath I meet does not have this? The same with the characteristic hand movements. What do they look like?

Hi UpLate, welcome to the forum.

Regarding the icy stare. How long have you known this person you think might be a Psychopath? I think the icy stare part usually happens when the "mask" is dropped, at least that is how it has been described, icy, blank, dark eyes etc.

Di

P.S. Keep in mind nothing you do will ever change one but it is good to have as much information as possible to avoid what could be a bad deal.

Happy New Year to all...

In reply to:

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What do they look like?

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Like you and me. Appearances can be deceptive!

Don't rely on appearances to spot a psychopath! They could look like the wino in the alley or George Clooney...

The missmatch between word and deed is what to watch for. Sugar syrup in the ear plus psychopathic behaviour.

I haven't actually seen those icy eyes. Or I'm not sure. They weren't really void of emotion, like I've heard that they are, but he stared at me intensly. His eyes were big, and I felt uncomfortable at once. I have problems with talking to people I don't know too well. I find all kinds of eyecontac too over-whelming. I'm EXTREMELY shy so that wasn't really new to me. When I checked him again he looked shy and nervous. What was a bit odd to me was that he had his eyes on me almost all the time. I looked around, up, down and close my eyes when I talked to him, as is natural to me. But I felt more comfortable after a couple of minutes and didn't really see any menace in his eyes. His hands shook. Could he have been just happy to see me?

I'm insecure.

No, JustAMan, I won't rely completely on appearance.

Is there anything else I can look for? I mean, how do I expose manipulation?

Dear UpLate,

Here's what I know from personal experience.

Psychopaths are charmers, chameleons, and sun kings.

When a psychopath targets you they load you down with their attention and they do a lot of game work to put you at ease. They seem like the absolute most wonderful person in the world. If you are shy and have difficulty looking at them, they may gently take your chin and say very sweetly, "Look at me. Your eyes are so beautiful." They are absolute charmers in this early hunting phase, and they can make you feel solid and secure and wonderful. They can take all your anxieties away. They paint YOU in the most glowing terms, and tell you how wonderfully you have impacted THEM.

They will not look you in the eye when they are telling you the truth, only when they are lying to you or manipulating you. That is the easy test. If you know something to be true, ask them... if they tell you something you know is not true, they will do it staring you right in the eye. If they give you the correct answer their head will be turned far to the left or to the right or they will look down and to the side while talking. They hide themselves when they speak the truth. This is only the case when they aren't on guard. A psychopath can force himself to look at you while telling the truth, but this in not their natural state and they have to work hard at it. This inability to look you in the eye while telling the truth is NOT shyness. They can hold your gaze just fine while lying.

The amount of charm is unbelievable, so much so that if you are the least secure in yourself, it will seem like this person has something wrong with them. So they may tell you that they have never met anyone like you before, that you are incredibly insightful or talented or beautiful or intelligent or sweet or innocent... whatever positive quality they find in you, they will praise it to inordinate degrees and tell you that this one thing about you has impacted them in such a way as to have changed their life or opened new doors for them or some other outrageous claim. They may tell you that they never realized they had this empty spot inside themselves before, and that meeting you or talking to you has suddenly filled it. Whatever it is, it will be played to your story, whatever it is. But whatever the play, it will be WAY over the top.

Sometimes they rock back and forth or side to side when they are sitting or standing, as though self soothing, but only when they are at ease and not engaging you directly. This motion is slow and rythmic.

When confronted about anything they tend to shake violently, especially in the hands. When confronted they will never confess, but will lie or distract or confuse you. They are pathologic liars. The only possible way to get the truth from them is to hide your inquiry as praise or acceptance. Sometimes this works to get at the truth, but not always.

You won't see the icy stare during the hunt and capture phases. They reserve this for their victims. I've heard it called "lizard-like." To me it makes the person look like a walking corpse animated by pure evil. The eyes go black and there really doesn't look like there is anything human left there. It looks like possession. During the hunt and capture phase their eyes can be very warm and welcoming. They use their eyes like everything else to manipulate and control you. It can be a heady feeling what the P can do to you with their eyes.

Psychopaths are incredibly shallow and weak in character. You won't find them standing up for anything that requires fortitude or personal sacrifice. You won't find them doing volunteer work unless they are targeting a victim in that location. You won't find them working for social justice or social causes, unless they are on the board of directors. They never give unless it is a means to gaining much more.

They are selfish and self centered and this is one thing they can't hide completely. When asked for follow-through you will NEVER see a Psychopath doing anything for another person, where self-sacrifice or risk is involved. This is rigid. It really is all about THEM without exception. They take, they never give. But they will talk otherwise... Look for actual behaviors not what they say.

They are petty and this will show up in vicious gossip, which they use to try to make you feel part of their "inner circle." They have very little good to say about others (except you) and find gossip to be an easy way for them to vent the incredible amount of hatred that they feel for everyone without ever having to face confrontation - which they avoid with a passion.

They are what I call agressive passive-agressive to a hard to believe degree. So, for example, if you say something that they interpret to be a criticism of them, they may destroy something of yours in such a way that you can't prove who did it. Or they may do something loathesome, like urinate UNDER your bathroom rug. Or they may steal something of yours. Or they may ask you what you really want only to punish you by withholding that very thing. Or they may slip a drug in your drink and try to gaslight you about the subsequent blackout period. And they will always act innocent and without remorse or conscience about these things, like "What are you talking about? That's crazy! Honey, I'd NEVER do anything like that!" Yeah, whatever.

They often seem childlike and vulnerable. Things won't match up. There will seem to be a brick wall in places where normal human beings are pliable.

That's all I can think of for now, but if I can think of other things, I'll let you know. The best rule of thumb is if he seems too good to be true, he's probably a P.

Diane1969

hi UpLate,

The Gift of Fear
by Gavin De Becker
http://www.gavindebecker.com/books-gof.cfm

is a book about transforming your feelings of unease into a useful threat
assessment.

I commend it to your attention.

-WK

They are petty and this will show up in vicious gossip, which they use to try to make you feel part of their "inner circle." They have very little good to say about others (except you) and find gossip to be an easy way for them to vent the incredible amount of hatred that they feel for everyone...

They are the human tabloids among us, repositories of everything trashy. It's a good way of projecting as well and with the Ps I know at least, demonstrates their virulent self-hatred.

Sylvie