My email light is flashing, but when I go in, it says I have a message from Diane, but cannot open email???

Also, a message keeps coming saying I have more private messages sent or received and can't use this facility now.

Help, I am new member and have no private messages. Also, where is the new posting facility?

Jemmmy

Hi there,

This is my first ever forum, and I'm so glad that it's here - thank you.

My mother is a P and it's only recently that a psychologist clarified what this actually means, in depth. Although she was physically there I never actually had a mother. Despite living with the realities of her neglect and abuse I was never able to grieve what I didn't have because I didn't know what real mothering was about and on a deep inner level I'd never made sense of why I didn't have it. Or perhaps it's more accurate to say that I believed she never loved me because of some flaw inside myself. Even therapists who knew the abuse etc, still said, "Oh, but underneath it all she loved you, she's your mother." They just didn't get it that, no, she actually didn't, I just couldn't take that comfort and this was what I found so hard. I used to wonder what was so wrong with me that I just couldn't feel that she loved me. But once I learned that a core reality of a P is an inability to love, I realised my not being loved was not about me but her. This was a massive shift, a key that has opened a door for me to step through to a new layer of healing. Now I have finally, after decades, begun to grieve. I've also realised that just because she didn't love me it doesn't mean that I can't.

I know that I really need some support but I'm too afraid to reveal myself. My way of coping thus far has been to keep totally to myself. I understand that to the average person in the world just mentioning the P word in any seriousness way kind of makes then stop and take a double look at me. Even the psychologist put me through the griller. It might be the parent whose the P but as a P's child it's as though I have to automatically I'm not one. Crime by association, almost. On a level I understand, the psychologist means well, but there isn't the under-the-skin sense of 'knowing', and that's the massive isolation I hadn't been able to bridge. I've not met another person with a P relative, so the forum is really opening up this world for me. Thank you.

Sapphira

Hi Sapphira

I’m pleased you have found this forum, as you will see everyone here has had to deal with a P in their life whether, like yourself, the child of one or the parent, partner or sibling.

It is difficult to discuss this disorder with anyone who hasn’t been in the same situation because as you rightly say, they do a double take as they think of Ps as the mad serial killer not the ordinary looking man/woman in the street.

It sounds as though you have worked out some positive strategies to get your life back on track which is great. It seems as though you can stand back and look at the situation objectively so would benefit greatly by sharing your situation with others.

Please feel free to tell us as much as you need, it is also very therapeutic to write things down and there are plenty of people here who will be very happy to give their support. You will find the people who relate closely with your circumstances are willing to discuss things with you and will listen which is so important as you probably have never openly discussed your problem with anyone else.

When you feel ready maybe you could tell us what things have been like for you and how your mother came to be diagnosed.

Regards
Jan

Hi Jan,

Thank you for your reply. You are right, I haven't talked openly about this with anyone, apart from the psychologist recently. It's wierd because I've seen so many therapists and counsellors over the years, and I was able to talk about particular incidents of abuse and my experiences, but I just ended up repeating what seemed like random experiences without any logic. They'd try to 'place' her. Narcisstic? Borderline? Anitsocial? But nothing fit. How could it? Thing is, now I have a frame in which to hang the picture of my life, and I'm absolutely terrifed to talk about what happened.

I lived my entire life juggling to keep these balls in the air. Now I can stop. And while it's a wonderful place to get to after so many sacrifices and hard work to survive, I just can't trust it, yet. Nowhere to put roots down into 'normal' life, shell shocked all my life, 'normality' is hard to adjust to. So late into my actual life I feel like I'm only just beginning. Now that I have found something of my self I can see just how much of my life I have lost. Shattered to bits. I don't know if one lifetime will be enough time to put me back together. But yes, I'm working hard to find a track in my life. And despite everything I do realise that it could have been a lot worse. She refused to support me financially since I was 12 and so I learned early on to make my own way, although she retained rigid control over my life in all other ways. But I managed to get out when I was 17 and never went back. It then took me more than two decades before I was able to expose her enough to stop her harassment and attempts to have me 'locked up', one way or another. I've had NC for six years and lost my entire family in the process but at least I now have a chance. If I hadn't got out I wouldn't even have that.

Sapphira

hello Sapphira,
Welcome.
I joint this forum a month ago.I was as happy as you are with it!!
My son is the p in my life.
The more I read about it , the more I realize that both my parents had to be too.
It's not that I am ignorant about it. I just was to buzy with other things, and of course surviving my son to think about that possibillity with these people.
Thereby...I didn't see them since I was about 16 years of age.
I will tell some other time about that life I had to live then.

For now I want to respond on your posting.

You are an incrediblle woman.

If you are able to be the way you write than there is nothing at all that really can put you down.
A lifetime to recover? NO WAY!
Think about it...Now you know...now you can put te blame where it belongs. Bit by bit you can take the shame away, the feeling of not being good enough, the feeling that if your mother isn't loving you, who would... all those things, all those feelings, all that has happend can find a place, can get in another place than in your heart, your system
All that energy you used to survive can be used now to build your live the way you choose.

You are a grown up woman..not before, maybe in age you where, but I mean the way things can get in perspective now...the information you get now, it will help you to put it in order, to make any sense about it...( as far as there is any sense in living with a p in your life)
You know now there's nothing wrong with you. As an adult you can get grip of your live now. NOW your life begins. YOU are the one who can give it the form you want, be what you want, do what you want, surround yourself with people you like.
Start with little things..Ask yourself is this what I want...or am I doing this because I was learned to do this...Is this way of thinking the way I want to see things or is it the way she made me see it.
My toothpast...do I really wan this one Or is it an old habit?
This way you make your life your own. Make things yours and this way you can mold your live the way you please.Starting with little things make you succeed and going along you get stronger.

You will also greave, but the worlds keeps on turning and time will heal.

I wish you well.
Again, as Jan said already, feel wlcome and write the things you want to tell about..We will read, and we will react.
Love Segaya

Hi

I've just found this interesting link.

http://www.cbc.ca/quirks/archives/06-07/sep30.html#4

Scroll down to Inside the Mind of a Psychopath
Listen to or download the mp3

I have met with one of the doctors interviewed from this radio programme and have also visited UCL to give a presntation and talk about my experiences so I found it fascinating.

Regards
Jan

Hi Segaya,

Thank you for your lovely reply! I keep re-reading it, wanting to thank you earlier but this whole process of reaching out, I suppose, has been quite overwhelming - desperate to connect but so not used to it when I do.

You made me laugh, though, when you mentioned the toothpaste...I can so relate to that:) Everything is a choice now, everything, even which toothpaste I want to use. It's so new, and so hard at times, because sometimes I feel I don't know how to choose. Small choices can be so stressful because it brings me face to face with a freedom I haven't had.

When I look back and ask myself, where was I in such-and-such experience? I know I did xyz, but was it really what I wanted? And there seemed to be no 'I' to want. There was never allowed to be. It was so pervasive and scary now when I look at it, but the way it was from the start. The 'it' I just realise, is the amount of control. And it was when I tried to assert myself in small ways about matters relating to my body and essential rights to me that all hell broke out.

When I did get away physically I was still handicapped by the fact that I'd never learned how to make choices for myself and importantly, how to say no. It was only when I was being counselled after being raped when I was 21 that the crisis worker leaned over and quietly told me that, actually, I have a right to say "no". Boy, that was something! So you really hit the nail on the head when said about now being the grown woman. It happened almost overnight. The psychologist gave me some books to read and it all started to fall into place. I'd been frozen for decades and then suddenly there was a shift. A big shift, like stepping into shoes I'd been floating above all my life.

It's a big process of adjustment now, coming to life, but I feel a peace with myself, because the way I've been all my life finally made sense. I grew up with a P whose underlying rationale was to wield total control over me and this is what I became. But at the same time there is the realisation, looking back, that saying no wasn't the only normal thing I didn't have. I never heard words to describe feelings. My mother, never once in my life, ever asked how I felt about anything. Just a void. I knew something wasn't right when I started to mix with people to whom I got close enough that they asked me how I felt about things (and that must sound wierd too) because the concept of what 'I felt' was so foreign and once I got it, I didn't have the words. Over time I got the words. But it's a wierd thing to look back and just see that realm really never figured in my life and environment at all. But now it makes sense. It just wasn't part of who she was. Our life was mechanical. We functioned, physically. There was a mess, we cleaned up. But there was never any recognition that maybe someone's favourite milk jug got broken, and what that might mean. It just wasn't there. The 'it' being meaning. No wonder I was so depressed! Now there is an open road ahead, comparatively. And I think the reason I keep re-reading your post, and those particular words, is because they reflect such a profound process - obtaining myself.

So thank you. Truly.

Sapphira

Hello Sapphira...
Glad that you can use it....
I can relate to what you told...I have been there..... So I know there is a way out.

My parents where also p's now I know.
I will tell in short...
I was born 48 years ago. I wasn't even 4 months old when the doctor discovered a sexual transmitted disease in my mouth and throut.
Long after that..when I was around 22 years I asked my mother( or whatever to call her) why she let this happen..her answer;...'it ment that he would leave me in peace'... This is a nice way to put it, but to translate her true words is difficult..it wasn't very
nice!!!
after my parents divorced my mother started to work at home as a sort of prositute. Now I think that is her hoice and I know more people who did, and several do this job to get food for they're children..so no judgement there from me!...The thing I don't like and didn't understand at the time is that se send me with these man..I was around 6 to 8 years at that time...
When she remarried, that man was terrible..he couldn't keep his hands off of me and when he didn't succeed in doing what he wanted he beated me severely. I had brain demage, broken ribs, bruces, but also he attacked me with a knife.
When I just turned 16 I ran away and never went back. I saw them every somuch years for minutes at a time.
Those times I tend to ask her things about what happend. All the answers I got where the same;
'If he did it to you, at least he didn't do it to me'...

My reason for existing was to be used, and after being used to be thrown away. I was worthless. I recognize what you say about no consideration whatsoever with my feeings. They just didn't excist. I didn't have toys...I wasn't allowed to play or have friends. me and my older brother had to take care of her,the house and ( if there was any) the food.
They, my mother and stephfather, used to go out to have nice days; on the beach, or go to a place where they could see or do nice things..like the zoo...
I wasn't allowed to go also. But they woke me up and I have to make they're lunches and drinks for on the way.
I want to be loved, that they would like me, so one day I didn't go back to bed after they left, I started to clean the house.. Started in the front room. took the glascurtain down and washed it, ironed it, hang them back, take the dust of, hoovered. Now you need to know we had 14 dogs with long hair and 16 cats with long hair.. And a mother who didn't clean the house..You can imagine perhaps how this house looked like??!!!!
I cleaned the bedrooms and change the bedsheeds, Cleaned the kitchen and brushed a few dogs.
I ate 2 slises of bread and took a glass of milk during that day. I didn't wash the dishes..that is..a plate , a knife and a glass. but put it under the sinck in a cupboard.
When they entered the house again around 10 pm, my stephfather went straigt to the kitchen., opened the cupboard under the sinck, took out those few dishes and beated the hell out of me for leaving them instead of cleaning them and put them in the right place.
I was silently crying in the kitchen when my mother entered... She looked at me..hit me hard in the face and added;
So ...now you have something to cry about...
The work I did was never mentioned and they acted that they never even noticed.
This is not a acceptional story..This is normal living in that household, that family.

Like you, and I told this before on this forum, I didn't know the smallest things, I had to ask people, ( and fortunatly there where people around who I dair to ask). Indeed as you say..On a certain moment you feel something, what and how to handdle it ,is a mystery.... Also how to dress, ho to behave around strainge people, how to introduce yourself to somebody new. How to use make up in a modest way......I can't even remember .... And honestly? It doesn't matter anymore.

I am complete human being now. And I dair to say that because of it all I know myself in a way that most people don't, I can look at my self and see what is wrong or where it could be better, to do things in a diffrent way. This seems to be rare. For me, and probably for more people on this forum , it's normal. That's what we learnd to do..
If somebody tells you constantly you are wrong, you learn to look and see if it is treu.
So observing yourself is a habbit.
Maybe even more importened; I can see what is right to do, that I am a good person who tries to life a live that is pure, I surround myself as good as possible with people who are worthy and try to be good human beings.
Everything I do, what I am is by MY choice, and mine alone.
Yes it took a long time, and yess there was a lot of pain and sadness. But what I tell everybody else,I also told myself. If I could survive this Hell..Than come on world. I can do it all!!

I am a therapist for over 22 years now and in my work I am succesfull.
This is my achiefment and mine alone....I have nobody to thank for it but myself.
I simply (!!!) used my inner strenght and believe me..we all have this inner strenght.it's not for the few..it's for all of us.
Take it with small steps at the time..If you want to ask me what a possible next step could be..please do. Jan knows I will offer this help to people here on this forum and said it's oke.

GO GIRLLL....

Love segaya

Hi Segaya

It was so painful to read your story and I can’t imagine how hard it was to write. I am so full of admiration that you can live through such horrific events and come out the other side. I am even more amazed that you are such a well-rounded person now. We hear so many excuses that people’s childhood turned them into the rotten adult they became. In your case you would have every reason to blame your childhood. You did the opposite and turned everything round and are now helping others.

It makes me feel pathetic for talking about the problems I have had, they are nothing compared to your experiences. I think we will all benefit from hearing how it is possible to overcome such atrocities and will look upon you as a great inspiration to change our circumstances if they are wrong. Also it shows us that it is important
not to blame ourselves for being at the mercy of others. Most people don’t choose to be victims.

It just goes to show the “nature V nurture debate” is alive and kicking! I have come to the conclusion after many years of research that if you are not born with the psychopathic gene then nothing that happens to you can make you a P. If you are born with the propensity to be a P then, yes, maybe that gene will be ‘switched on’ by circumstances. I think that is what would be classed as a sociopath not a psychopath.

I think everyone reading your story will now think ‘ if Segaya can live through her ordeal then I can live through mine and move on too’. I would imagine that the mental scars heal over but the marks are still there and will never go away.

I would like to thank you for being so open, your story will now become a point of reference for me. Every time I feel like complaining in future-I will think again!

Regards
Jan

Dear Segaya,

I am so very grateful that your shared your story. It's heart-breaking to imagine you as that little girl, so alone, trying so hard, doing her very best, to be so abused and, as you say, used up and thrown out. It's just so sad.

Your words have had a tremendous impact on me. They have really got under my skin. I felt as though you were right here, almost whispering in my ear. I was stunned, actually, and yet what you related was also very familiar to me. It's affected very me deeply and I am still taking it all in, but just wanted to touch base with you to acknowledge the gift of your story....and to let you know I would like to respond more fully in a while.
In the meantime, a very deep thank you Segaya.

Sapphira